Which Monitor is best?

[Nejc Kilar]

If I may suggest so what I found like a good solution for me was to increase the "text size" in Windows. So DPI I have on 125% and text size is set to slightly larger. Found that to be working pretty well for me. I do wear glasses though.

The screen I'm on is equivalent to a 32" 4k display (its the Samsung G95NC).

[Basshunter]

You might just be sitting further away :- ). I use 150perc. for 32" 4K with tripple surround (3x32") and 150perc. for 27"/4K when I am travelling with  single or dual 27" monitors but I sit much closer to that setup.

I use additional 125perc. scaling on top for internet browsing.

Even with my lens or glasses, I couldn't do 125perc. either and I would find 175-200perc. to be very comfortable for text but already problematic with how it condenses all visual elements. It's all compromise sadly for text vs graphic parts.
Apple does 200perc. for 27" 5K resolution, so it's not like you're in some too odd territory :- ).

No way. My eyes are just 45cm (17 inches") away from the monitor. In fact, the text at 125% is even smaller than the text on a WhatsApp chat on my phone. I'm on a 27" Dell U2723QE

[Vuk]

I am reviving this thread after some time. Has anyone tried so far the new Dell U4025QW ultrawide IPS black monitor? And any new monitors on the horizon that are worth trying?

[Juraj]

That Dell is very good, the "black-IPS" panels are very decent, but the monitors are very expensive for what you get (which is just slightly better IPS..).

I will write review of recent WOLED monitors (OLED panels from LG, I tried both LG and Asus version). QD-OLED (the Samsung version without polarizer) is not good fit for work. I'll make a post next week.

[tatarka]

Philips Momentum 27M1N5500ZA/00
does anyone use? any thoughts ?

[Basshunter]

I will write review of recent WOLED monitors (OLED panels from LG, I tried both LG and Asus version). QD-OLED (the Samsung version without polarizer) is not good fit for work. I'll make a post next week.

Looking forward to reading this since I’m in search of a new monitor.

[Juraj]

My ASUS ROG Swift OLED PG32UCDP (not to be confused with QD-OLED panel based UCDM model) took unfortunately 2 more weeks to arrive, I've received it just yesterday. I've sent my 32GS95UE-B back 2 weeks ago as well.
But I presume they will be roughly identical, except for the ABL algorithms which can be fully turned off on Asus, but not on LG.

Shortly, LG implemented super-weird ABL that creates "Vignette" across like 60perc. of the screen, even with PeakBrightness OFF, so uniform SDR brightness.
That makes it impossible to do any professional graphic work because half of your screen is different brightness than the centre. It's not traditional ABL which turns up&down brightness across whole screen.

Because of that, the only WOLED-panel OLED monitor that can be used professionally, is the ASUS version, because Asus allows to turn all this crap OFF in OSD menu. For LG, you need to use special menu that voids warranty and also resets every-time the monitor as much as goes to sleep (so 20 times a day).

I wouldn't consider QD-OLED panels for work because lack of polarizer means they have purple tint in every daylight settings. I presume majority of us aren't gaming vampires so that is big no-no for color-critical work.

Funny thing is that despite the LG 32GS95UE-B and ASUS PG32UCDP being identical monitors, you can get the LG as low as 1100 EUR on Amazon and Asus is 1600+ Euro. ASUS tax in Europe..

[Basshunter]

My ASUS ROG Swift OLED PG32UCDP (not to be confused with QD-OLED panel based UCDM model) took unfortunately 2 more weeks to arrive, I've received it just yesterday. I've sent my 32GS95UE-B back 2 weeks ago as well.
But I presume they will be roughly identical, except for the ABL algorithms which can be fully turned off on Asus, but not on LG.

Shortly, LG implemented super-weird ABL that creates "Vignette" across like 60perc. of the screen, even with PeakBrightness OFF, so uniform SDR brightness.
That makes it impossible to do any professional graphic work because half of your screen is different brightness than the centre. It's not traditional ABL which turns up&down brightness across whole screen.

Because of that, the only WOLED-panel OLED monitor that can be used professionally, is the ASUS version, because Asus allows to turn all this crap OFF in OSD menu. For LG, you need to use special menu that voids warranty and also resets every-time the monitor as much as goes to sleep (so 20 times a day).

I wouldn't consider QD-OLED panels for work because lack of polarizer means they have purple tint in every daylight settings. I presume majority of us aren't gaming vampires so that is big no-no for color-critical work.

Funny thing is that despite the LG 32GS95UE-B and ASUS PG32UCDP being identical monitors, you can get the LG as low as 1100 EUR on Amazon and Asus is 1600+ Euro. ASUS tax in Europe..

Thanks for your answer. May I ask what monitor you use for color critical work right now?

[Juraj]

Old Benq PD3200U. I pondered updating to some of the faster mini-led IPS panels but I found them quite mediocre (and expensive for such) so when OLED went mainstream this summer I decided now it's finally the time.

The WOLED based LG 32GS95UE-B was absolutely perfectly in every way almost except for the vignette crap (which LG calls "Convex Power Control", apparently to lower power draw, to save electricity.. ? It's not like the monitor doesn't have few additional classic OLED ABL algorithms that you can turn off, but you can't turn off the CPC).
I expect the PG32UCDP to be likewise perfect.

These are gaming monitors though, and they come with some wonky calibrations. The colors were good in all modes, but they feature slightly tweaked gamma profiles where all the profiles have stronger black-clip. This is imho done to make the contrast appear more impressive. OLED have infinite contrast in theory, but in practice, during daylight, there is no strong wow-effect (night-time is something else). So they made this weird 2.2 gamma which crushes blacks. Needs either custom calibration (but only LG offers hardware calibration, Asus relies on ICC profiles, so will be ignored by majority of Windows including Max/Corona) or using Blacks Stabilizer, which is boosts the blacks. That's not exactly calibration... but the result works.

For clamping colors to sRGB space during work, I am using https://github.com/ledoge/novideo_srgb instead of using the OSD profile, which find limited in functionality (and not exactly perfectly calibrated anyway).

At the moment, in 1000 to 2000 Euro budget, you can get mediocre "IPS Black" panels (Contrast 1:2000 is actually just 20perc. more contrast that typical 1:1000 IPS, because of logarithmic perception) with 60HZ and edge back-lighting, mostly so-called "Fast-IPS" panels which barely touch 1:1000 (usually they're 1:850-900 at best) at 120-144HZ at lower price range, or Mini-led based at upper price range, but even with 2000 Zones, you have to turn it off for any non-video work, it's just not sufficient, you would need like 20 000 zones at minimum on 32" monitor.

So 1200-1600 Euro for actual 4K 240HZ 270 Nits SDR brightness DCI-P3 color-gamut OLED monitor... that's pretty amazing. Compared to the above, which is just lot of money for subpar and inferior tech.

Another topic is the baby-sitting (hidden taskbar,etc.. )...

[Nejc Kilar]

... (but only LG offers hardware calibration, Asus relies on ICC profiles, so will be ignored by majority of Windows including Max/Corona)...

Hmm are you sure about this though? I've just recently calibrated my screen and the ICC profile that I load in Windows affects both the 3ds Max's / C4D's UI and the Corona VFB - along with all the color managed apps like Affinity / Resolve / PS.

I've tested it with different, wonky ICCs (for a bigger difference) just to see if it really affects things and it appears to do so indeed.

Although yes, hardware calibration is definitely the most reliable option because you are absolutely sure it works in all cases as long as your monitor works :)

[Juraj]

I am 100perc. (no 99.9) that 3dsMax is non-calibrated until 2025 version, which does feature OCIO color management and capability to load color profiles. If Corona inside 3dsMax already respects that, I don't know, thought I have some doubts as I haven't seen any release note mentioning compatibility.

Cinema4D had color management for far longer time.

Regardless, NoVideoSRGBClamp is much better solution as it acts like 3D LUT inside OSD, it's super-imposed on top of everything else. It can also load ICC profiles too and do the same.

[Nejc Kilar]

Hmm, so maybe I'm doing something wrong but here's the procedure:

- Create an ICC profile (via calibration etc)
- Load the ICC profile in Windows Color Management
- Start up 3ds Max, create a random color intense render and save a PNG file
- Open up Affinity (or PS), load up the saved render and make sure the ICC profile in Affinity / PS is set to the ICC
- Compare the VFB you have open with the file in Affinity / PS

So doing that I can see the Corona VFB matches the Affinity / PS document that is set to the ICC profile.

I've also tried live switching between the default sRGB Windows profile and the ICC I created and that also shows the difference as I switch between them.

Since I'm not touching any of the OCIO tools in any of the apps, could it be a Windows update that enabled this? :)

[Basshunter]

Old Benq PD3200U. I pondered updating to some of the faster mini-led IPS panels but I found them quite mediocre (and expensive for such) so when OLED went mainstream this summer I decided now it's finally the time.

The WOLED based LG 32GS95UE-B was absolutely perfectly in every way almost except for the vignette crap (which LG calls "Convex Power Control", apparently to lower power draw, to save electricity.. ? It's not like the monitor doesn't have few additional classic OLED ABL algorithms that you can turn off, but you can't turn off the CPC).
I expect the PG32UCDP to be likewise perfect.

These are gaming monitors though, and they come with some wonky calibrations. The colors were good in all modes, but they feature slightly tweaked gamma profiles where all the profiles have stronger black-clip. This is imho done to make the contrast appear more impressive. OLED have infinite contrast in theory, but in practice, during daylight, there is no strong wow-effect (night-time is something else). So they made this weird 2.2 gamma which crushes blacks. Needs either custom calibration (but only LG offers hardware calibration, Asus relies on ICC profiles, so will be ignored by majority of Windows including Max/Corona) or using Blacks Stabilizer, which is boosts the blacks. That's not exactly calibration... but the result works.

For clamping colors to sRGB space during work, I am using https://github.com/ledoge/novideo_srgb instead of using the OSD profile, which find limited in functionality (and not exactly perfectly calibrated anyway).

At the moment, in 1000 to 2000 Euro budget, you can get mediocre "IPS Black" panels (Contrast 1:2000 is actually just 20perc. more contrast that typical 1:1000 IPS, because of logarithmic perception) with 60HZ and edge back-lighting, mostly so-called "Fast-IPS" panels which barely touch 1:1000 (usually they're 1:850-900 at best) at 120-144HZ at lower price range, or Mini-led based at upper price range, but even with 2000 Zones, you have to turn it off for any non-video work, it's just not sufficient, you would need like 20 000 zones at minimum on 32" monitor.

So 1200-1600 Euro for actual 4K 240HZ 270 Nits SDR brightness DCI-P3 color-gamut OLED monitor... that's pretty amazing. Compared to the above, which is just lot of money for subpar and inferior tech.

Another topic is the baby-sitting (hidden taskbar,etc.. )...

I’m not sure. Sounds like a lot of hassle to me. For 1300 Euros, you’d expect everything to work smoothly out of the box. I might just stick with a cheaper IPS for now.

[Juraj]

Hmm, so maybe I'm doing something wrong but here's the procedure:

- Create an ICC profile (via calibration etc)
- Load the ICC profile in Windows Color Management
- Start up 3ds Max, create a random color intense render and save a PNG file
- Open up Affinity (or PS), load up the saved render and make sure the ICC profile in Affinity / PS is set to the ICC (Explain?)
- Compare the VFB you have open with the file in Affinity / PS

So doing that I can see the Corona VFB matches the Affinity / PS document that is set to the ICC profile.

I've also tried live switching between the default sRGB Windows profile and the ICC I created and that also shows the difference as I switch between them.

Since I'm not touching any of the OCIO tools in any of the apps, could it be a Windows update that enabled this? :)

There is indeed auto-color management with latest Windows 11 update, or it's been there since January if you're on fast-track. I haven't tested it as I don't run these builds with it yet.
It's called..."auto-color management". https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/auto-color-management-in-windows-11-64a4de7f-9c93-43ec-bdf1-3b12ffa0870b

If not that, then there are few more things to consider:
- Do you have wide-gamut Display and are you running wide-gamut mode in OSD? (Native, or DCI-P3/AdobeRGB). Unless you have monitor that greatly exceeds sRGB color gamut, you will not see noticeable color shift. This shift would also be strongest in Red tones.
 ICC profile merely interprets color in OS, it runs on top of what the monitor's OSD is set to. That's why ICC is always paired to specific monitor mode, and if you switch it's not longer applicable. So for wide-gamut environment, you would run Native or specific wide-gamut mode in OSD, and then calibrate after that to ICC which matches the desired color-space. The possible working combination go from higher to lower (so Wide-Gamut to Low-gamut) or equal to equal (HG to HG or LG to LG).
- What do you mean "make sure the ICC profile is set", Working Space ? When you import file, you can convert to profile (which should be default settings if you don't get asked), or assign profile (which is meant to interpret colors when profile is missing). Since I am not on 2025 with OCIO, my 3dsMax (or Corona VFB for that matter) doesn't save with any color-profile attached to file formats.
- Your file (render) should be converted to space you intend to work in and the working space should like-wise be set to generic (non-device specific) color-space (sRGB or P3/AdobeRGB/.. for Wide-gamut. If you load your monitor ICC, you will disable color-management.


- If you want to be sure, set working environment in Photoshop to sRGB (that is default). On importing render, set the mode to "convert". On opening, convert the render to sRGB color-space. Make sure the auto-mode in Window is disabled if by any chance this latest update is on. And only after that, compare 3dsMax Corona VFB and your opened render.

I don't understand right now 100perc. which exact combination you're doing, but in my opinion you most probably negated color-management and are seeing incorrect (but identical) colors in both 3dsMax and PS. That's actually quite easy scenario to achieve. Seeing identical colors doesn't mean you have correct color-managed workflow pipeline.

It doesn't matter though, I can guarantee you 3dsMax until 2025 simply isn't color-managed, it can load Gamma 2.2 and that's about it. With the OLED I have right now, single-toggle of sRGB in NoVideo tool shows almost 20perc. perceptible difference in red saturation, matching the srgb coverage of WOLED panels (125perc. QD-OLED up to 150perc. even)

[Juraj]

I’m not sure. Sounds like a lot of hassle to me. For 1300 Euros, you’d expect everything to work smoothly out of the box. I might just stick with a cheaper IPS for now.

Yeah, they're sadly gaming and gaming-only monitors. Definitely not plug&play for work as of yet. But doable, since for archviz I don't think the setup is as critical as it is for print&photo/etc..

The only purely for work OLED monitor, based on bankrupted JOLED company (and their specific JOLED ink-printed panel, different from WOLED/QD-OLED), LG 32" OLED 32EP950 is discontinued and was very expensive, even discounted I've never seen it for less than 2500 Euro I think. It was also only 240 Nits and 60HZ and very, very strong matte foil (LG just loves to do this to monitors...).

I mean, these 4K 32"OLEDs came just this year, it's novelty. 1-2 years and it will be mainstream and we'll see artist or professional oriented models as well. (like Asus ProArt instead of Asus ROG, and LG UltraFine, Dell Ultrasharp, etc..).