Quality vs time in production

[subpixelsk]

Hi guys

I am wondering how do you approach final production quality in your workflow. I usually have to deliver 15 - 20 images per project , sometimes more, sometimes a bit less. I wanted to crank up my usual resolution to 3k but this in combination with 3% noise limit (which still is not very low) reults in +-3 hours per rendering. And that´s a lot when multiplied by number of images.
So what is your standard resolution you deliver your images in? Do you use render farms or in house computers? I have one WS with dual xeon setup (to be upgraded soon) and one node with 1950x build so not bad but simply not enough to be able to produce image in 5k or more. But my question is - is the resolution purely your choice? Unless it is going to be printed on some large billboards, does it make sense to render in more than 3k for example?
I have used rebus in the past but nowadays I try to render all work inhouse.

Will be happy if you share your thoughts on this

[Nejc Kilar]

I guess it depends from business to business but I usually just render it locally. Either on the dual xeons, workstation or both. I render at 5k minimum these days and so the renders take longer for sure. I combat that by letting the computer do its thing after I sign off so thinking about it like that it has like 16 hours in the day to render.

Doing the math, if an image takes 5 hours to render I guess I can churn out 3 images in a "working day". Like you said though, some images take only a couple of hours to render while others need more.

I prefer rendering it locally because using Corona for C4D (still in beta) in a render farm environment is just asking for trouble I guess. Even when I was using 3ds Max I preferred rendering locally. Actually, I just prefer rendering locally for many reasons really, one of them being that I just really dislike sending a render to the render farm, paying for it only to notice that something for some reason did not render properly - or I forgot to turn on a certain knob. That live preview I get from rendering locally just makes me feel super comfortable :)) Plus any extra hardware is mine to keep which is super fun to me to play around with.

Whenever a project is too big (animations in general) or has a super duper deadline I resort to render farms. In that case I bill the render farm expenses to the end client or I take more upfront. Retainers are a thing of necessity imho.

But yeah, locally as much as I can. Granted though, I do have a fairly high scoring workstation (dual 2696v3s score around 4400cb) so it most certainly helps.

Not sure if any of that is helpful to you but hey :)

[SHORT CUTS]

We work like nkilar, if it can be done over night its rendered locally. If we have to do a set of images like 10-15 in your example we try to get some shots done before the others and render them while we are still working on the other images.
If the job requires very large renderings, animations or lots of images which we couldnt render before the deadline then it goes out to a renderfarm. Nowadays they are so cheap and fast, i dont see any reason not to use them on a tight deadline.

[subpixelsk]

I guess it depends from business to business but I usually just render it locally. Either on the dual xeons, workstation or both. I render at 5k minimum these days and so the renders take longer for sure. I combat that by letting the computer do its thing after I sign off so thinking about it like that it has like 16 hours in the day to render.

Doing the math, if an image takes 5 hours to render I guess I can churn out 3 images in a "working day". Like you said though, some images take only a couple of hours to render while others need more.

I prefer rendering it locally because using Corona for C4D (still in beta) in a render farm environment is just asking for trouble I guess. Even when I was using 3ds Max I preferred rendering locally. Actually, I just prefer rendering locally for many reasons really, one of them being that I just really dislike sending a render to the render farm, paying for it only to notice that something for some reason did not render properly - or I forgot to turn on a certain knob. That live preview I get from rendering locally just makes me feel super comfortable :)) Plus any extra hardware is mine to keep which is super fun to me to play around with.

Whenever a project is too big (animations in general) or has a super duper deadline I resort to render farms. In that case I bill the render farm expenses to the end client or I take more upfront. Retainers are a thing of necessity imho.

But yeah, locally as much as I can. Granted though, I do have a fairly high scoring workstation (dual 2696v3s score around 4400cb) so it most certainly helps.

Not sure if any of that is helpful to you but hey :)

thanks a lot! for sure it is helpful. How did you decide to go with 5k resolution minimum actually?

[Nejc Kilar]

5k? Well... I guess to be honest I render filler jobs at a lesser resolution. Those are usually small, I get them done in a couple of hours and its just helping people out I guess - For a decent pay still.

For any project that is supposed to be "serious" I just do 5k because it will print on pretty much anything. It gives you ~300 DPI at an A3 paper size and around 100 DPI at A0 size which is supposedly looking really cool at around 90cm.

It is like a fail-safe resolution for me in case the client wants to print the thing on a bigger piece of paper. Now I do usually ask the clients if there is a chance they will print it and if they say "hell no, not a chance in hell" then I render at a lower resolution and lower the price accordingly. Most of the time I guess clients want to retain the ability to print the renders but they don't exactly know what size they'll be printing on. In that case I tell them, lets do 8k (if the funds are there) or you know... We can do 5k which is solid for up to A0 basically. Its like a median resolution for me that enables them to do both plus it doesn't kill my render times like 10k would.

I still do 8k+ renders very often because certain clients really need it.

Honestly though, even if the client kind of thinks an A4, A3 format will do I always suggest to do at least 5k because frankly, they themselves aren't sure if they won't ever want to do A2, A1 or A0 prints.

Instead of me charging more when they come back for higher resolution renders after a few months I kind of try to avoid that from the get go. Its kind of a consultant thing I guess so its always good to have a good dialog and insight into your clients business and their wishes.

Render sizes are easier to manage if you act in a consultant type of role to the client too, say if you get to know the ins and outs of their advertising stuff and consult them what to do and where to skimp on budgets etc...

[subpixelsk]

do you have any formula on calculating the price according to resolution?

[Nejc Kilar]

do you have any formula on calculating the price according to resolution?

Sorry, not really. Each shot is quite different and fairly unpredictable. In general I approximate the time needed and just go with that... Probably not the best approach as sometimes you get burnt and at other times you get a little extra to cover for the times you got burnt.

Do you do it differently?

[Juraj]

Resolution or volume is all about managing. Backburner/Other manager is absolute must. Never wait for render, render everything overnight.

But don't give high-resolution images without high-resolution price ;- ). I am not saying to price different resolution differently like in stock-photography, but high-resolution is form of higher technical quality and should be priced accordingly.

I render everything in 8k for multiple reasons. One dominant is that our clients often do print stuff up, and 8k is both necessary for pretty magazine spreads (Often in A3+ kind of size) as well as billboards. But other, I love to show off all the attention to details that go into imagery. All those detailed models, shaders and textures, it looks better if you can appreciate it up close (or in print). It shows craftmanship, and clients do notice.

Similar to photography. Creatively, beautiful photograph can be shot on cheapest phone. But large prints always benefit from large format systems, it's part of the allure of high-end charm.

[Nejc Kilar]

@Juraj,

Thats actually a great point most people completely overlook. If you create an 8k image in full detail there is just so much more that goes into it - not to mention the assets themselves.

[Juraj]

At least, clients need to pay for that overpriced memory inflation we are suffering from :- ).  High resolution is struggle !