Scandinavian housing visualisation

[fellazb]

You set the overall multiplier at 0.1 which I think you should also highlight since the default is set at 1.0

I only use cg-source hdri's and you can leave it at the default but PG hdri's you need to tweak I assume? Always a bit unclear why PG hdri's have to be set that low for "correct behaviour".

[Edvinas]

You set the overall multiplier at 0.1 which I think you should also highlight since the default is set at 1.0

I only use cg-source hdri's and you can leave it at the default but PG hdri's you need to tweak I assume? Always a bit unclear why PG hdri's have to be set that low for "correct behaviour".

Fixed.

Well, Peter could tell more about this. But anyway, while it works, no reason to complain I think. I only tweak hdri's if I need full backround with surroundings, sometimes it does a great job for reflections. But this time default sky was used

[subpixelsk]

Are you using corona tonemapping at the same time with vfb+? what do you mean by 32bit - do you save the output as 32bit exr and then open it in vfb+?

[Edvinas]

Are you using corona tonemapping at the same time with vfb+? what do you mean by 32bit - do you save the output as 32bit exr and then open it in vfb+?

First question – as you see, yes. VFB+ has wider range of settings which helps a lot.
You don't need to save output as exr and load it in VFB+. Well, at least I don't do that. When rendering is done it automatically loads into VFB+, like in native 3ds max vfb. But after I do adjustments with VFB+ I export it as 32bit into photoshop and finalize everything else in the same mode. It just lets you have more info in photoshoping. And only when I am happy with the image, I export it as simple jpg or other web format.

[Juraj]

You set the overall multiplier at 0.1 which I think you should also highlight since the default is set at 1.0

No because this doesn't matter at all. Multiplier is the same as exposure. If you lower HDRi multiplier, you have to rise image exposure. Or vice versa. The resulting image is the same, because just like frame-buffer, the HDRi also also linear.

Regarding the second issue:
Did you ever tried putting CoronaSky into material editor ? It's completely over-exposed, because that's physically correct brightness for it. Same goes for PG's default exposure, although I never tested how close it it.

CGI has adopted different convention, and that is the 1:1 for human eye adaptation, but this forces you to use incorrect physical values for other lights or exposure if you leave it like that. You know how you have to use values like 0.05 if you add CoronaSun :- ) ? That's the inconsistency for physical based approach.

Also the guy suggesting to use between 0.454 (reverse gamma ? just no :- ) ..) and 0.7 for HDRi is really bad idea. You can lower gamma for HDRi which lack dynamic range, like some of PG's, but only within measure. 0.7 is already quite extreme, will result in strong color shift, and botched specular amount.
For CG-Source, I found that some of them, are almost 1:1 to CoronaSky/Sun in terms of dynamic range, and never had to go lower than 0.9. It's better to use software like HDRStudio or just manually in Photoshop to boost Sun to correct levels instead of using gamma trick.

[Juraj]

Only 32bit workflow.
 It just lets you have more info in photoshoping

This is btw not 32 bit workflow, and no, it's not working even if you think it is :- ).
You're doing post-production in 3 steps, but only the first is linear/true32bit. A lot of redundancy that's not doing anything.

You can only do tone-mapping to linear image once, than it's no longer a linear image. So you can't (technically you can because it enables you but it really doesn't work as should) use both Corona HL compression and VFB+ compression.

Also if you already used HL (any) compression, there is no need to save as 32bit/linear, because there is no such information anymore for post-production.
It's like saving jpeg as openexr in PS. Yes it's 32bit/Linear openexr...but inside is still 8bit clamped jpeg with no such information. It's only waste of disc space and also blocking PS toolset.

[Rotem]

That's only partially accurate. Even if all highlights are compressed to <= 1.0, floating point 0.0-1.0 32-bit data is still more accurate than integral 0-255 8-bit data and you can perform more aggressive color correction on it without undesired artifacts such as banding.

[Juraj]

That's only partially accurate. Even if all highlights are compressed to <= 1.0, floating point 0.0-1.0 32-bit data is still more accurate than integral 0-255 8-bit data and you can perform more aggressive color correction on it without undesired artifacts such as banding.

Of course, but it isn't linear. If you don't need linear files just better color depth, you only need 16bit non-linear file (like tiff/png/etc..).

Otherwise, you still have to clamp down to 16bit in PS to use non-linear tools, because the linear tools like exposure have no info to work with anyway. Saving as floating point linear format would only make sense if you would still want to do some (non-linear) compositing in apps like Fusion/Nuke. But PS will not allow that in 32bit mode, and what it will allow you, will not have the information there to work with.

It's not partially accurate, it's just people conflate the tonal depth and linearity.

No one saves as 8bit jpeg ;- )

[Edvinas]

Thanks, Juraj,

I've just shared workflow I used this time. And only this way gave me +- the result I wanted.

Will definately give a try for guides you mentioned and test if it works for me :) What is interesting.. You said that there is not point to save as exr for photoshop, yep, I can agree partly. But if I want to tweak some parts(regions) of the image in photoshop? Thats extremely important in my workflow. For example first plan shadows or else. Neither corona or vfb lets me do this(correct me if I am wrong), so photoshop is only the way. Somehow those shadows looks better when I tweak them in 32bit than in 8bit.

EDIT. Got the answer before I wrote the question. :))

[Juraj]

Somehow those shadows looks better when I tweak them in 32bit than in 8bit.

Everything looks better if you compare 8bit to 32bit :- ).

Imho 32bit (by which everyone really means just linear) is overkill for PS post-production if used with already clamped image. PS has only handful of tools working (and some of those not even correctly) in linear mode, and those, along with plugins like ArionFX require unclamped data (for tonemapping and glare/bloom deriving).

I used that workflow extensively for years, and many still do (with popularity of ArionFX), but then shouldn't use any clamping in framebuffer.

If you do, then it's simply only logical to continue treating it like high color depth non-linear file like .raw photography and use tools that work natively for that (CameraRaw and PS in 16bit mode). ALL the benefits on better color depths and avoiding of artifacts like banding.

[Juraj]

I've just shared workflow I used this time. And only this way gave me +- the result I wanted.

Hah, hope I don't sound patronising :- ) I didn't want to. It's super cool everytime someone shares info ! So big thumbs up for blog. You even shared the exact name of HDRi, which makes you hero of the month :- )

I just wanted to set some things straight before lot of people adopt it blindly (you know how lot of people copy without thinking about why you did it).

I did that a lot in past and it lead to funny situations :- D Ondra remembers... like my famous MSI400 :- D

[Ondra]

Did you ever tried putting CoronaSky into material editor

technical side note: we detect that CoronaSky is displayed in material editor and under-expose it there just so it is not completely overexposed ;)

[Juraj]

Did you ever tried putting CoronaSky into material editor

technical side note: we detect that CoronaSky is displayed in material editor and under-expose it there just so it is not completely overexposed ;)

Well that's just sneaky. But it's still over-exposed for human eye so it should get the idea across that it's rather bright :- )

[Edvinas]

I've just shared workflow I used this time. And only this way gave me +- the result I wanted.

Hah, hope I don't sound patronising :- ) I didn't want to. It's super cool everytime someone shares info ! So big thumbs up for blog. You even shared the exact name of HDRi, which makes you hero of the month :- )

I just wanted to set some things straight before lot of people adopt it blindly (you know how lot of people copy without thinking about why you did it).

I did that a lot in past and it lead to funny situations :- D Ondra remembers... like my famous MSI400 :- D

No worries, most of us are here to learn something. And it requires experimentations, so it's nice to get valuable comments on them :)

[yagi]

honestly,...its all sounding like a rocket science mathematical equation the way you guys say these things. not your fault, u guys are just way ahead of me in this render archviz game :(