Chaos Corona Forum
General Category => Porting and API => [Archive] Corona Scatter 2.0 => Topic started by: Ondra on 2014-08-28, 14:27:50
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Post your feature requests for Corona scatter here. I will start:
- Density/scale/... texmaps
- Distribution from splines
- Uniform patterns (grid/lattice, ...)
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multiple input meshes / proxies
possibility to adjust amount in case multiple meshes in percentage ex. 30%flowers - 60%grass - 10%rocks etc. you got my point.
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ehm, that is already implemented...
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I can think in some features :)
Include-Exclude areas with splines with degradation betwen both
Scatter on a spline path
Collision detection
Detection of edges (i mean that the scattered object dont break the given path, Like the grass growing in the sidewalk or so)
Clusters of elements (of the same elemments)
Color variations, and vertex colors
Brush proxy painter
And a lote more from more advanced users!!
Btw this is an excellent news! Glad to be on corona side :)
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Could I add a request to enable scattering within a complex object rather than just a bounding box of the object?
For example: create a thick torus knot in max and scatter some boxes on it. When setting the scatter type to bounding box rather than "on surface", it just creates a scatter within a box to the bounds of the torus knot, rather than what I'd like to have happen where the scattered boxes are spread evenly throughout the torus knot. I realise that I could fiddle with the translation parameters of the scattered objects but doesn't always work for complex shapes.
This would be very useful for creating thickly scattered objects, now couple this with density maps and we could create some cool stuff.
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Will this be multi platform? - i.e. work with c4d corona - when its released!
As a feature I like the sound of the edge detection / boolian to stop overspill.
Cheers
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Camera clipping! Also the ability to change some parameters of animated meshes (re-timing).
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Just make it Multiscatter+Forest
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Just make it Multiscatter+Forest
hehe the short way.
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Just make it Multiscatter+Forest
My thoughts exactly :)
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Just make it Multiscatter+Forest
My thoughts exactly :)
it is pretty bold to expect this one extra free plugin for a renderer to cover everything done by 2 scatter plugins costing about 300 euro each...
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Well
What you think about coronapattern such as vraypattern? (;
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Compatibility with Maya's Xgen, of course thinking in Maya's version of Corona :)
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Post your feature requests for Corona scatter here. I will start:
- Density/scale/... texmaps
- Distribution from splines
- Uniform patterns (grid/lattice, ...)
and
-saving presets and apply it to new base opbjects
-based on home made pattrens
-camera clipping ---> yes, + ignore the area behind an object which is not seen by the camera, if the latter is possible????
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ehm, that is already implemented...
It does, but it is not very precise. I do not know is it because of the way random algorithms are designed or something else. Try following numbers for instance:
scatter count: 10
box frequency: 0.3
sphere frequency: 0.2
cylinder frequency: 0.5
Above should you give results as follows: 10 objects scattered across surface of your choice, 3x boxes, 2x spheres and 5x cylinders. You will be surprised that numbers does not matched up. Checked on both, Halton and Congruent.
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-scatter inside of object (volume)
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ehm, that is already implemented...
It does, but it is not very precise. I do not know is it because of the way random algorithms are designed or something else. Try following numbers for instance:
scatter count: 10
box frequency: 0.3
sphere frequency: 0.2
cylinder frequency: 0.5
Above should you give results as follows: 10 objects scattered across surface of your choice, 3x boxes, 2x spheres and 5x cylinders. You will be surprised that numbers does not matched up. Checked on both, Halton and Congruent.
What would happen if you choose count: 1000 instead of 10?
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The only thing I ask is this:
- Density/scale/... texmaps
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ehm, that is already implemented...
It does, but it is not very precise. I do not know is it because of the way random algorithms are designed or something else. Try following numbers for instance:
scatter count: 10
box frequency: 0.3
sphere frequency: 0.2
cylinder frequency: 0.5
Above should you give results as follows: 10 objects scattered across surface of your choice, 3x boxes, 2x spheres and 5x cylinders. You will be surprised that numbers does not matched up. Checked on both, Halton and Congruent.
What would happen if you choose count: 1000 instead of 10?
Since I did not find a quick way to convert Corona Scatter object into anything where I can count object automatically, I lowered total to 100 and count it manually:
scatter count: 100
box frequency: 0.3
sphere frequency: 0.2
cylinder frequency: 0.5
Results are:
30xBoxes
52xCylynders
18xSpheres
My guess is 1k will not going to be correct either.
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ok, then it is probably working correctly - the object types are generated randomly - so the real percentages are also random. If you would change seed, you would get on average your input value, but values with different seeds can slightly differ. It is done this way because it is simpler, and most times, the exact percentage cannot be achieved (e.g. if you would have 30.5% of one objects)
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Yep, seems like perfectly normal probabilistic behavior.
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It would be nice to have better selection of distribution and scattered objects directly from viewport. Right now, one have to press + sign, pick object, press + again, select another object and so on and so on. Too much mouse clicking.
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There's actually a trick not many people know, but many 3ds Max features and plugins rely on it.
Click the button to initialize picking session, then press H to open select by name dialog, select all the objects you want to add, and click pick :)
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This trick is well known, but it's not needed here, because Corona Scatter itself has such funcionality. I'm talking about picking objects from viewport directly. It's useful when scene objects aren't named properly.
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ok, then it is probably working correctly - the object types are generated randomly - so the real percentages are also random. If you would change seed, you would get on average your input value, but values with different seeds can slightly differ. It is done this way because it is simpler, and most times, the exact percentage cannot be achieved (e.g. if you would have 30.5% of one objects)
OK then I rest my case :) but wait... During my last test, I did mention problems with selecting scattered object individually. Any way to address this issue? Or is it a way to select it?
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Me request. It's in FP, but not in MS
(*) possibility to delete by painting, the scattered objects. It's very useful!
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The ability to not have self-intersection.
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This trick is well known, but it's not needed here, because Corona Scatter itself has such funcionality. I'm talking about picking objects from viewport directly. It's useful when scene objects aren't named properly.
Yes, Multiscatter does that by doing some multi object picking session, but it often caused performance problems they have not been able to completely resolved yet. So it may come at a cost.
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Hi, I agree with all requests posted above + I would suggest slope detection with different slope detection thresholds/settings for each object, rgb color rotation/scale variation maps (as the ones in multiscatter) and maybe even some height thresholds too + hand painting/scattering objects while considering those slope detection/threshold settings - well nothing special :)
Slope detection to make such http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/steep-rocky-mountain-slope-landscape-bucegi-mountains-romania-36037323.jpg things a breeze - ugly colors on that photo but it's good as an example :)
Height thresholds + slope detection + variation maps to make something like this http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-bN0SvgeAn0Y/Uh4jQ97PfyI/AAAAAAAAAtM/Kh60KFH3t-0/s1600/yoho.jpg
Well maybe not a breeze but certainly much easier :) Of course one could always use some density/slope maps generated by world-machine/vue/GeoControl or something similar but still density map support is needed for that not to mention other software + some knowledge of its workings. Other method (density maps are still needed) - one could use Gugila's groundwiz's Terrain Map ( http://www.gugila.com/products_gw.php?ID=gw2 ) yet I don't know if it is already supported + that map can be a real ramchewer if baked, well at least in some cases. And another - something like that http://www.3dm3.com/tutorials/mount/ - still density maps are needed and I suspect you won't get scatterer viewport preview unless that procedural is baked which again can be quite ram consuming depending on the scene scale and details needed.
All those methods can work pretty well, given the support for density maps, still if possible It certainly could be way handier to have that slope detection directly inside corona scatter just to avoid distractions and unnecessary meddling with other soft, not to mention it would make Corona even more awesome :)
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+1 for coronapattern like vraypattern. I have forespack, railclone, vraypattern. Vrapattern's functionality and usability replaces both railclone's and forestpack's in most cases and brings further they can't handle because of memory limit.
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I'd be happy with spline areas ( include and exclude ) with falloff .
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Hello,
I think one of the most important features is to have the possibility to make a color variation
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Hmmm I would think some LOD would be good to have - some distance from camera specified with randomized lod transition line one :)
See Gugilla's Groundwiz ( http://www.gugila.com/products_gw.php?ID=gw3 ) Or Carbon Scatter (
) for an inspiration - some really useful feature that one is ...
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ON/OFF button to temporarily turn off scattering when not needed.
Implemented.
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Under Transformations there is checkbox Allign frame to normal. Could be more useful if could be driven by numerical input (from 0 to 100) or even better by colour with ability to assign texmap.
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It would be very useful to have some sort of collision control. A "strength" or a percentage control that allows you to vary the distance set by then bounding boxes.
As it is now, it is almost impossible to cover an area with grass without using an incredible large amount of collided objects. Using collision will reduce the number dramatically, but will always leave some empty spaces around every object - due to the bounding box. By reducing the collision "strength" it would be possible to make objects come closer only slightly overlapping, and thereby cover an area with less objects than now.
Regards.
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Corona Scatter can only use map channel 1 and doesn´t have an on/off feature?
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Hello,
I think one of the most important features is to have the possibility to make a color variation
Yes, lack of color variation from bitmap is the main reason why I don't use Corona scatter, but I understand the 300 dollars argument.
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Now it's possible (Corona v1.0), thanks to the new CoronaMultiMap ;-)
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I have try it I'm able to have the color variation but not relative to a bitmap (use object colore in ms), how do You proceed?
Maybe i need to be moved to the I need help section.
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Just change the CoronaMultiMap Mode from "Material ID" to "Instance" and you can use "Mix amount" from 0-100 to mix the color. Very easy.
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Offset for "Avoid collisions" option to control density.
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Thanks, I still don't get it maybe I'm doind something wrong, I have tried it but, the mixed maps always takes the UV from the instanced object, not the distribution's one. I have tested it with 2 UVW Maps without result. I would like to achieve that kind of variations (it's working with MS and FP):
http://msue.anr.msu.edu/uploads/images/5-23-wheat-field-BRUCE.jpg (http://msue.anr.msu.edu/uploads/images/5-23-wheat-field-BRUCE.jpg)
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Quote from: Adi on 2014-08-29, 00:43:48
Quote from: vicnaum on 2014-08-28, 21:50:14
Just make it Multiscatter+Forest
My thoughts exactly :)
it is pretty bold to expect this one extra free plugin for a renderer to cover everything done by 2 scatter plugins costing about 300 euro each...
Ondra : Unless you ask the fairsaas users, if they were willng to pay a few extra euros per month, and you could integrate a whole new corona scatter plugin or the names mentioned. :)
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Hello,
Are you plannig add more options to scatter tool?
I suggest a few:
1. Scatter count per square meter. Now all time when i change size of surface area, i must calculate new count parameter.
2. Something like EDGE option in forest.
3. Avoid collision percentage radius option.
3. Scatter on spline. For example if i want to scatter bushes along path. I think i cant do it now in current scatter tool.
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Merged topics: https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php/topic,5044.msg58278.html#msg58278
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- Add on/off checkboxes next to each texmap slot in CScatter. It's very inconvenient to clear and drag back maps when you want to temporarily disable them.
- Ability to scatter grouped objects.
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One special feature that would change the way of scattering objects...
A spinner to select the degree of the distribution objects normals to scatter on.
Imagine you have a rangy landscape and would like to scatter trees only at slope, you could set a range of degrees and you are set.
Maybe call it distribution by normal angle of source object.
Enhanced with a slider to select the range in height in which the scatter will occur this would be one thing the competition has not.
Just an idea :)
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well I guess you can plug in falloff map into the texmap slot... it should work when using world Z axis ;)
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Couple propositions:
allow avoid collisions - strictness to go to negative values, so instances could repel each other with greater distances than their bounding boxes. Implemented.replace transformations from-to with offset. That way you'll have more space in UI to add maps to each slots. That would greatly improve CScatter possibilities, IMHO. Attaching possible UI mockup. 1st - original UI, 2nd - UI with offset, 3rd - alternative version with check boxes. V2 looks more clean, but V3 has so desired checkboxes. Though decision :] I didn't touch scale section - don't know how to improve it.
edit: made new additions to mockup in post #57
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i hope let scattering Group object as instanced object
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Thanks for strictness enhancement!
There's couple more requests:
- it would be nice to have statistics on actual number of scattered instances somewhere in CScatter settings.
- don't know if possible, but it would be very very cool to have ability to assign random material id to instances.
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don't know if possible, but it would be very very cool to have ability to assign random material id to instances.
CoronaMultiMaterial? :)
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Is this some hint? :]
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- Since items in distribute on objects and instanced objects lists are not editable, it's impossible to see full item's name in case it's quite long. Horizontal scrollbar would help here or alignement by right at very least.
- Ability to select more than on item in distribute on objects and instanced objects lists, so it'd be possible to change frequency and density values en masse.
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Add third dimension to CoronaScatter icon so it would be easier to select it from side views.
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Please add support for animated objects , for example i have a tree with wind and want to bake that to corona proxy (with animation) and then i want to use that in corona scatter . and also it would be awesome if we have some animation control like randomness and offset and ...
thanks
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Updated my CoronaScatter transformation panel mockup: 1. added separate global and local controls to scale 2. swapped translation and rotation controls - i hink such order is more common than current one.
Please add support for animated objects , for example i have a tree with wind and want to bake that to corona proxy (with animation) and then i want to use that in corona scatter . and also it would be awesome if we have some animation control like randomness and offset and ...
thanks
Animation is already supported, even with deformational MB. Ability to randomly offset it would be more than welcome though.
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Please add support of Material Shader transposition form the distribution object to the scatter object .
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To have support for 3d maps in density slot when scaterring type is set to by volume would be awesome.
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Camera reaction "Scatter only in the Camera Viewed Area" That helps in some cases.
Is there a way to create "multiscatter converter"?
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spline exclude areas please
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Would it be possible to use AO map as a density/scale map for edges?
I tried this to differentiate between large and small grass clumps to tidy up a hard edge but I couldn't get it to work. It did get it to work quite nicely with a hand painted map, but I was hoping for a more automatic solution.
Thanks.
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Be abble to pick an animated geometry as the "distribute on object" and NOT have the "intanced objects" redistributed over the animated surface as it change its form. Like to produce the fur of an animated character, or the trees of an talking vulcano like in the pixar short movie.
Is there any way to do this?
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It is already implemented in daily builds and will be available in v1.5
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Can I download and use the daily build?
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If you're eligible to do so, i.e. you're owner of FairSAAS or Box with subscription licences, then yes, definitely. Here's instructions on how to start using daily builds: https://coronarenderer.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/5000530719-installing-daily-builds
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Please add a way to manually define the position of scattered objects. In Forest Pack its referred to as 'custom edit mode'.
I couldn't find this setting anywhere in corona scatter and it's a major deal breaker for workflows, where one needs to precisely define the position of say trees and still wants to benefit from all the goodies like random scaling, rotation and instancing.
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Relative save paths, such as ./render/…. and naming tokens (as featured in GSG tutorial here: https://greyscalegorilla.com/tutorials/tokens-name-renders-c4d/).