Author Topic: 5950x, 7950x or 12900K for an upgrade?  (Read 3267 times)

2022-10-18, 02:57:50

Basshunter

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After 7 years, I think the time has come for me to make an upgrade. However, this is making me feel overwhelmed for some reason. 3 main options are in my head: 5950x, 7950x and 13900K.

First of all, I'd like to determine which of those CPUs will allow me to re-use some parts from my current rig. Some of these parts are:

Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S https://noctua.at/en/nh-d15s
RAM: GSkill Ripjaws4 8Gb (x8) http://www.gskill.com/product/165/172/1535953333/F4-2133C15Q-32GRR
PSU: Corsair RM750x https://www.corsair.com/us/en/Categories/Products/Power-Supply-Units/Power-Supply-Units-Advanced/RMx-Series/p/CP-9020179-NA
Case: Fractal Design Define S https://www.fractal-design.com/products/cases/define/define-s/black/

I know 5950x and 12900K uses DDR4. But, will my current sticks work with those without causing any bottle neck?
What about the cooler? Will it work with any of those too? Same for the case.

On the other hand, I'd like to know how they compare in terms render speed. I've been looking at some YouTube videos and also some benchmarks but to be honest, I still have problems figuring it out. Is there any way to know how fast they are with respect to each other in terms of percentage? Like for example: X gives you 50-60% faster render times than Y?


2022-10-18, 17:03:05
Reply #1

Juraj

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My answer from previous thread still works quite well for this question as well :- )

Ryzen 7950x is out now, just FYI.

7950X + DDR5 + Any board = Quiet a lot of money.

In terms of performance (from most to least) :  Ryzen 7950 > i9 13900 > Ryzen 5950 > i9 12900

You can use DDR4 even for the newest Raptor Lake based i9 13900K, it's the biggest benefit of the platform. You have to buy the respective board though.
You sadly can't reuse all 8 modules of memory though, only Threadrippers and Xeons have 8 memory slots.
It will not cause any meaningful bottleneck in Corona Renderings and majority of workstation tasks.

You can reuse your 750W PSU, but you have to use low-powered GPU and ideally power limit both CPU and GPU. 750W is very little for current CPUs & GPUs, mainly because of transient spikes (300W GPU can temporarily use up to 500W, even if it's just fraction of second).
You can use your D15S cooler with Raptor Lake and Ryzen alike. You might just need a bracket, Noctua sends it for free if you still have sale receipt.
You can reuse your case, but you will need to keep the front open all the time for enough air-flow. Latest  CPUs & GPUs run very hot.
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2022-10-18, 17:31:16
Reply #2

Basshunter

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My answer from previous thread still works quite well for this question as well :- )
Yeah, I've been reading those several times. My friend just went for the 5950x and is so happy with it. I don't know why I just feel so overwhelmed by this task. Maybe it's because I know I won't be upgrading in many many years and really want to make the best decision.

You sadly can't reuse all 8 modules of memory though, only Threadrippers and Xeons have 8 memory slots.

You can reuse your 750W PSU, but you have to use low-powered GPU and ideally power limit both CPU and GPU. 750W is very little for current CPUs & GPUs, mainly because of transient spikes (300W GPU can temporarily use up to 500W, even if it's just fraction of second).
This means I'll have to buy new RAM sticks anyway since using only 4 from my current set would leave me with 32gb which is too little for the type of projects I usually work on. On the other hand, I'm really looking forward to get a RTX nvidia card like a 3090 for UE, so according to what you said, my current PSU will be useless.

Do you think there's an easy way to calculate the price of those 3 rigs by myself? Maybe a website you know where I can find those already set up in order to roughly compare prices?

2022-10-18, 20:26:24
Reply #3

Juraj

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Yes, even nVidia itself officially recommends 1200W. I've been suggesting such PSUs for years because PSU operates best at 50perc. load. Getting "just enough" was always wrong advice, I am glad those recommendations will now stop.
1200W is what I would suggest in general to buy, Gold rating standard, and reputable brand.

If you need to buy new memory, that makes DDR5 argument somewhat stronger. I personally haven't checked what the prices even are right now, I just presume "very high".

But in my opinion, do not buy last-gen. If you can't afford 7950X + DDR5, get Raptor Lake. The single-thread performance improvement are the best thing ever for fast, smooth workflow. It's so much more important than rendering time. Rendering time on workstation are meaningless, it's still hours for high quality still, it will still get rendered over-night. Few seconds on benchmark here or there don't matter that much in grand scheme, but faster work does.

Raptor Lake looks amazing for the price:

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare/3617vs5022vs5031/AMD-Ryzen-Threadripper-3960X-vs-Intel-i9-13900K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7950X

With GPUs, don't hurry too much.. it's still pretty bad right now. There will still be quite a price fall by start of next year.
« Last Edit: 2022-10-18, 21:38:09 by Juraj »
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2022-10-20, 23:42:38
Reply #4

Basshunter

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But in my opinion, do not buy last-gen.
You mean last gen of DDR5? Like it's better to choose some cheap DDR5?

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare/3617vs5022vs5031/AMD-Ryzen-Threadripper-3960X-vs-Intel-i9-13900K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-7950X
I can see 13900K clockspeed is 3.0 GHZ. Isn't that somehow low? 7950x is 4.5 GHZ. Would you mind shedding some light on it?

With GPUs, don't hurry too much.. it's still pretty bad right now. There will still be quite a price fall by start of next year.
I'll hear you advice and wait. Buy the way, what do you think would be a nice price range for a RTX 3090 to be considered a good deal? On the other hand, do you think this is the card I'd should be looking at for UE and chaos vantage? 4090 it's gonna be a beast but the price is so high in my opinion. What do you think?


« Last Edit: 2022-10-21, 03:47:02 by Basshunter »

2022-10-21, 09:21:37
Reply #5

Juraj

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Last generation of CPUs (5950X). 7950X or 13900K are current generation.

They have the same frequency.

Good price range for 3090 would be around or slightly less than 4080. It would be less powerful, has older tech (no DLSS3), but 24GB instead of 16GB, making it good for rendering.
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2022-10-21, 18:22:38
Reply #6

Basshunter

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Good price range for 3090 would be around or slightly less than 4080. It would be less powerful, has older tech (no DLSS3), but 24GB instead of 16GB, making it good for rendering.
I can find some new 3090 Ti GPUs like the ASUS GeForce RTX 3090 Ti TUF GAMING for $1000 in some local stores here. I just wonder if there's any significant difference between those aftermarket versions and the founders Edition (Titanium and black).
« Last Edit: 2022-10-21, 18:26:24 by Basshunter »

2022-10-21, 20:57:20
Reply #7

Juraj

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Try to find the non-TI version, for any rendering, you will not benefit for the increased power draw limit, in fact, you will probably limit it slightly to more reasonable heat output & noise.
FE version is just prettier design, otherwise, the 3rd party OEMs (Asus, MSI,etc.. ) have better cooling design (even though it's ugly and much bigger).
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2022-10-21, 21:14:06
Reply #8

Basshunter

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Try to find the non-TI version, for any rendering, you will not benefit for the increased power draw limit, in fact, you will probably limit it slightly to more reasonable heat output & noise.
FE version is just prettier design, otherwise, the 3rd party OEMs (Asus, MSI,etc.. ) have better cooling design (even though it's ugly and much bigger).
Thank you so much for the advise. I really find all this information really helpful.

Going back to the 13900K vs 7950x thing, there's only one thing I'm still considering. It is power consumption and how each CPU will affect electricity bill. So I'm trying to figure out whether there will be a significant difference between these two. That could turn a good deal into a more expensive option on the long run, no? What's your opinion on this?
« Last Edit: 2022-10-21, 21:55:34 by Basshunter »

2022-10-21, 23:14:03
Reply #9

Juraj

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Where are you from? You quoted US dollars. The electricity there is nowhere near what we pay in Europe right now and even that won't make big difference for this class of workstation.

There is no power difference between Intel and AMD right now, by default, both CPUs boost into 250-300W, which is way past their optimal place on efficiency curve. But you can easily limit this in bios.
Anywhere between 150W to 200W will let you retain 95perc. of multithreaded performance.

And then...what is that compared to GPUs :- ). 3090/4080/4090/etc.. by default boost into 400W. That is the actual Sauna unit :- )
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2022-10-21, 23:51:01
Reply #10

Basshunter

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Where are you from? You quoted US dollars. The electricity there is nowhere near what we pay in Europe right now and even that won't make big difference for this class of workstation.

There is no power difference between Intel and AMD right now, by default, both CPUs boost into 250-300W, which is way past their optimal place on efficiency curve. But you can easily limit this in bios.
Anywhere between 150W to 200W will let you retain 95perc. of multithreaded performance.

And then...what is that compared to GPUs :- ). 3090/4080/4090/etc.. by default boost into 400W. That is the actual Sauna unit :- )
Good points. Once again, I really appreciate your opinion. Our conversation has given me the pushed I needed to start looking for more info and make my mind.

2022-10-26, 17:45:10
Reply #11

Basshunter

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Hi Juraj!

Is there any specific feature I should look for when choosing the motherboard and ddr5 sticks for a 7950x? Or maybe something I should be aware of?

2022-10-26, 17:56:58
Reply #12

Juraj

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I cannot offer any advice there sadly. Since I am not planning to buy anything this year I didn't bother looking at all what's available.

Maybe someone who already bought such a build can post his.
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2022-11-30, 13:07:53
Reply #13

jamesdowling

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Good price range for 3090 would be around or slightly less than 4080. It would be less powerful, has older tech (no DLSS3), but 24GB instead of 16GB, making it good for rendering.
I can find some new 3090 Ti GPUs like the ASUS GeForce RTX 3090 Ti TUF GAMING for $1000 in some local stores here. I just wonder if there's any significant difference between those aftermarket versions and the founders Edition (Titanium and black).

Just to quickly chime in here that there's some good GPU prices currently on ebay (if you don't mind used and the risk that comes with that) I think lots of people have upgraded to the new 4090 and are selling the last gen cards atm, I just picked up 2 x 3090fe for £800 each. One of the cards I need to replace the thermal pads as it's running a bit hot (known issue for the 3090fe) but all in I would have paid the same as a 4090 fe, which has been impossible to get in the UK.

2022-12-05, 09:33:37
Reply #14

Juraj

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Used 3090s will be killer deals for 3D artists. I wish I could find FE edition here, I love the design,  but they were never really available in continental Europe outside of Germany mainly so they're not on used market either.

Plenty of other AIBs for around 750-800 Euro though mirroring your UK pricing.

Unless one can source 4xxx at actual mrsp, they're just pissing away money.
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