Huge Slate editor bug

[Guillermo Leal]

I posted here this bug since its not corona related, but i have read many slate editor issues here and i don't think is corona related.

this problem has been bothering me for a long time, i finally had some time to try to replicate it so i can summit it to autodesk.
the slate material editor is practically impossible to use on heavy scenes which are what i use most of the times.

basically if you have a scene of let's say 15000 objects and you try to modify the material in the slate editor by adding lets say a noise map, it will be impossible to move around or edit anything in the material editor again until you restart max.

below i have provided the steps along with a script to reproduce it. even if you have more then 15000 objects/materials you can still modify them relatively fast until you try to add some maps or something else.
I have tried this on 3 renders (standard, vray and corona) they all do the same thing so its a max issue, there must be a memory leak in the slate editor.


1.- run the script attached to create 15,625 objects/materials
2.- open the slate editor
3.- open one of the materials and tweak anything, diffuse for example. it will be fast
3.- right click to add anything (noise map). max will freeze for a little while and after this step max is useless until you restart.

please let me know if anyone else can confirm this.

thanks,

[Ondra]

3dsmax does not scale at all because there is significant internal message spam. If you change anything in the material editor, it will propagate through all objects in the scene, even though the material is not even used in the scene - which for 15k objects take ages.

[racoonart]

I'm not sure if it's exactly the same thing but things like that exists since Slate first shipped with 3dsmax (2012 if I remember correctly?). The problem was not Slate itself but the new material/map browser. I made a test back then having 10.000 objects with 1 single material applied to all of them - as soon as you tried to open the material/map browser (even in the compact editor) max froze for about 20 minutes.
The issue can be solved by simply activating the old browser again via ini setting -> instant response, even with 10th of thousands of objects. This obviously only helps if you're using the old compact mtl editor, slate is still using the new one, but hey, at least you can do some work :)

[Guillermo Leal]

Ondra:
but why it does not happens in the compact material editor?

DeadClown:
i have always use the old browser, the new ones are useless too slow. 
on the slate editor i always have the material/map browser off, if its on then its super slow.  maybe i will have to come up with a script so i never call the browser as it seems that triggers the bug/leak starts.

[Juraj]

but the new material/map browser

It's this.

All my scenes are basically 10 000+ objects, and I imagine that holds true for most archviz companies. By the time I am finishing the project, I am dreading any final material tweaks because it's painful...accidental clicks on 'map' almost bring me heart attack.

3dsmax does not scale at all because there is significant internal message spam. If you change anything in the material editor, it will propagate through all objects in the scene, even though the material is not even used in the scene - which for 15k objects take ages.

Pretty epic :- )

[PROH]

Hi. This could be an explanation to some of the troubles I've had lately. So if anybody could tell me how to switch Max to use the old browser, I would be thankful :)

[pokoy]

I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing this issue. The new mat/map browser worked for me in 2012 but not in 2014 or 2016, it was just impossible to work with on scenes with high object count. I remember having reported this long ago already but the more of us do this the more likely it's going to get looked at... hopefully.

To switch to the old mat/map browser, locate the file 'SME.ini' in your local max settings folder:

 C:\Users\*UserAccount*\AppData\Local\Autodesk\3dsM ax\2016 - 64bit\ENU\plugcfg_ln

 look for this line

 UseOldMtlBrowser=0

 and change it to

 UseOldMtlBrowser=1

[Bormax]

 
on the slate editor i always have the material/map browser off

The same here. Working with materials I always try to minimize the usage of material/map browser. But even if I have to use it I always have Scene Material unchecked in Material/Map Browser Options. To minimize the usage I just create all needed materials/maps by clicking right button on empty space of slate editor and choosing what I need from drop down menus, and after that I just connect them. Or I drag connector from material's/maps gray/green circles and again choose what I need from drop down menus. This way is much faster for me than click to the button None in Parameter Editor on the left side or in Compact Material Editor and wait when the material browser will appear.
I tried your script and it takes about 80 seconds to open Slate Editor first time and the same time after changes in materials even with opened on left side Material/Map Browser and about 65 seconds when it's switched off. All kind of operations with materials don't make any problems and don't take longer time than in small scenes.
I use Max 2014.
Hope this information can help you in your work.

[Ondra]

I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing this issue. The new mat/map browser worked for me in 2012 but not in 2014 or 2016,

hypotetical example: Imagine you have a bug with a map not refreshing on scene objects. What is the simplest solution? Of course to iterate over all scene objects when any map is changed, find objects that have the map applied, and update them. Is it slow in big scenes? Yes, but it works! ;) Similar "fixes" are put to any sufficiently complex software all the time.

[pokoy]

I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing this issue. The new mat/map browser worked for me in 2012 but not in 2014 or 2016,

hypotetical example: Imagine you have a bug with a map not refreshing on scene objects. What is the simplest solution? Of course to iterate over all scene objects when any map is changed, find objects that have the map applied, and update them. Is it slow in big scenes? Yes, but it works! ;) Similar "fixes" are put to any sufficiently complex software all the time.

Awful way to fix issues, probably a case of letting things slide through and hoping scenes are small and computers fast enough so nobody will notice. The thing that really bugs me is how long it takes to really fix this, it's there for at least 3 years now and should have produced lots of red lights within their reporting system, maybe just not red enough.

[Ondra]

well from my experience in reporting bugs, certain companies have a policy "just being slow is never a bug"

[romullus]

Dunno if i doing something wrong or not but luckily i don't experience such problems with SME. I tried script by OP out of curiosity and everything seems fine. SME opens with significant delay for first time (10-20 sec), but after that i can work with materials without lag. Max2014 sp5, new material/map browser and it always open. So maybe there's something more in this issue. There can be not so much report about it at Autodesk, if not everybody experience it :]

[Ludvik Koutny]

I too never experience this, but that's probably because when you use slate (or at least when I do), I usually get entire project done without need to open material/map browser even once :)

[PROH]

@pokoy: Thank you for the explanation. I'll try it, and see if it helps :)

[maru]

I can't recall experiencing this either, even in scenes reported by the customers. I think this would require some further investigation and my theory is that it could be connected with some 3rd party plugins.

Not happening when running the script from 1st post and performing all the steps either. Other than Max getting pretty laggy, there is nothing that would make working in it impossible, no freezes.