Author Topic: Corona Render Test M1 and M1 Max  (Read 8315 times)

2022-07-19, 17:36:00

Chules

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The render results with the mac book pro M1 Max are worrying. I have been greatly disappointed. I don't know if the mac is not as powerful as we are told or that at the moment corona render is not optimized. Surprisingly other applications work amazingly on M1, much better than on Intel Mac. The cinema 4d itself on the M1 is a joy to use, much smoother than the latest intel i9 iMac. Do you know if work is being done to improve the corona performance in M1? Because I get the feeling that the M1 and M1 Max processor is very powerful, but that the crown does not take advantage of it. Thank you and greetings.

2022-07-19, 17:46:08
Reply #1

frv

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I work with a Mac Studio m1 128Gb.
I think the performance is what you expect from a 20 core CPU. The benchmarks equal those of PC's with the same amount (hyper)threads. I notice though that the kind of scene or model and how "smart" it is modeled makes a huge difference. That aplies to PC's as well I would say.
The Mac Studio with its fast read and write RAM and SSD is a joy to work with. I think if you want GPU performance on final high res renders you need a different set up.

2022-07-19, 18:44:47
Reply #2

maru

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The render results with the mac book pro M1 Max are worrying. I have been greatly disappointed. I don't know if the mac is not as powerful as we are told or that at the moment corona render is not optimized. Surprisingly other applications work amazingly on M1, much better than on Intel Mac. The cinema 4d itself on the M1 is a joy to use, much smoother than the latest intel i9 iMac. Do you know if work is being done to improve the corona performance in M1? Because I get the feeling that the M1 and M1 Max processor is very powerful, but that the crown does not take advantage of it. Thank you and greetings.

Do you have some specific test scene that could be rendered on various CPUs so that the results could be compared? What exact kinds of results do you find worrying?

Are you able to monitor the temperature and usage of your CPU? Is it showing 100% CPU usage during rendering?

Marcin Miodek | chaos-corona.com
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2022-07-20, 05:57:53
Reply #3

bnji

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Hi, as Maru said, please provide us with your test scene files (including all necessary assets) and your hardware/software specs (OS version, CPU model, C4D version, Corona version, etc.).
You can include it here, or you can create a support ticket to include the files.
Please let us know the outcome.
Kind regards.
Benjamin Rosas | chaos-corona.com
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2022-07-20, 11:19:29
Reply #4

Philw

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Yep its not magic - a 10 core CPU is just a 10 core CPU. My perfomance to is what I would expect on my M1 Max - i.e. the same if I was on a non-Hyperthreaded 10 core PC.

I guess any optimisations will have to come from the Intel Embree raytracing kernels that everybody uses? (guess)
« Last Edit: 2022-07-20, 11:23:00 by Philw »

2022-07-20, 11:38:03
Reply #5

Philw

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Also, would be good if we could finally get a native M1 Benchmark tool?

2022-07-20, 13:47:33
Reply #6

rafaz

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I've been tracking scenes with my macbook m1 pro and I notice on the latest release vesion 8 hotfix 1 every now and then the cpu reach only 70% of it's power and it wont pass that, a fix for it is restarting the mac  but after awhile it caps at 70% again. With the latest daily it happens less frequently.

Monterey 12.4
Macbook pro M1 16"
Cinema 4d R26.107
Daily 9 may 23

I found the thread describing the same problem:

https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php?topic=35434.msg195962#msg195962
« Last Edit: 2022-07-20, 13:58:45 by rafaz »

2022-08-20, 02:31:18
Reply #7

rafaz

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No mention about the performance issue on the new build??

sad

2022-09-01, 08:04:13
Reply #8

masterzone

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Guys news about performance? I got a MacBook Pro M1 and I have this rendering issue with hotfix 1 as well.
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2022-09-01, 18:03:55
Reply #9

bnji

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Hello,

Thank you for your replies.
Please consider that Macbook's cooling system could not be enough to keep the CPU working at its full all the time.
Someone already mentioned something about expected performance using a Mac Studio, which has a better cooling system compared to a MacBook.
Are you using a specific monitoring tool that shows the 70% CPU capping issue?
If so, could you please let us know the tool and the steps you followed to find out the issue?
Please be as descriptive as possible so we can try to reproduce the issue.
Benjamin Rosas | chaos-corona.com
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2022-09-01, 18:20:28
Reply #10

Philw

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Can be seen just in Activity monitor. Ironically - if energy setting in system preferences is set to Low Power it squeezes out the most CPU usage - setting to High Power drops it to 600-650%.

Definitely some kind of "algorithm" going on.

2022-09-01, 20:05:28
Reply #11

leo3d

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Why render on Mac, Whyyy ????. Price/Power is ridiculous about Mac Computer
Go for it to RenderFarm

2022-09-01, 20:06:25
Reply #12

rafaz

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Can be seen just in Activity monitor. Ironically - if energy setting in system preferences is set to Low Power it squeezes out the most CPU usage - setting to High Power drops it to 600-650%.

Definitely some kind of "algorithm" going on.

Philw is right.. I managed to get couple of screenshots one in low power mode and high power:

I dont believe it's temperature issue, mine never get above 80-85ish C.

All my renders are always with the mac plugged in "High power" most of the time the cpu runs full speed and out of nowhere it drops to 650 ~.

Seems like something triggers LOW/High power mode and thats when it drops.

Im on r26

lates daily Aug 30th
Macbook Pro M1 pro 16"

2022-09-30, 20:49:13
Reply #13

rafaz

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hello all,

I see the new RC1 is out and no mention about the performance issue while hipower mode is on for macs M1, anyone tested this latest build ? Or any Dev could tell us if it was fixed on the latest buid'?

Thx

2022-09-30, 22:34:21
Reply #14

TomG

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If it's not in the changelog (https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php?topic=36221.msg203964#msg203964) likely nothing changed - sometimes something can be overlooked in the changelog but that is very rare, sorry.
Tom Grimes | chaos-corona.com
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2022-10-03, 14:12:59
Reply #15

rafaz

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If it's not in the changelog (https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php?topic=36221.msg203964#msg203964) likely nothing changed - sometimes something can be overlooked in the changelog but that is very rare, sorry.

I see, can we expect a fix for this? We haven't heard anything for the last 2 or 3 builds and now we're on RC1 and still no mentions about it.

Thx Tom!

2022-10-05, 09:08:10
Reply #16

davetwo

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I'm very intersted in this as I will be buying/using a M2 MBP when they come out. But for clarity - as we assuming there is a fix needed at the Corona end. Or is there a issue at the Apple end?

Are any of the testers on this thread also using a comparable CPU engine that they could also check? Is there also a dropoff using the new Redshift CPU mode for example? Or Vray CPU? (I think these are silicon enabled now?)


2022-10-05, 21:11:10
Reply #17

Philw

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Ha - don’t even consider comparing RS CPU - it’s terrible on everything - very very early days!

2023-01-18, 08:50:17
Reply #18

YURII

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Just bought a new M1 MAX MacBook 16 and I have same problem, when it is 'Automatic' or 'High Power' mode selected it drops to 60-70% CPU load, while selecting 'Low Power' it goes to 80-88%. Can we expect a fix sometime soon? Also, on intel, CPU load was close to 95-97%, so even with 'Low Power' we ain't getting the best performance.

Thank you!

2023-01-18, 12:58:08
Reply #19

TomG

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Posting in the one place (https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php?topic=38220 ) is sufficient, and better, as it keeps all messages in one place making it easier to gather the info for the team here, and easier for them to reply and ask questions.
Tom Grimes | chaos-corona.com
Product Manager | contact us

2023-03-31, 10:34:13
Reply #20

Chules

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First of all, I would like to thank the developers and the corona team because thanks to this rendering engine my work is easier and the results are very popular in my infoarchitecture area. I am a mac user, and I have renewed my equipment. I currently have the latest iMac i9 128GB that apple makes with an intel processor... it works great, I've had it for two years and both cinema 4d and corona work perfectly. I have acquired a mac Studio M1 ultra and it is incredible how cinema 4d, photoshop, illustrator works... a performance improvement is very noticeable when it comes to processing, saving, executing files and plugins. Cinema 4d moves wonderfully, everything is much more fluid. When rendering with corona I only see a slight speed around 10%-15% faster than the mac Studio M1 Ultra compared to the latest model iMac i9. However, Cinebench and Geekbench benchmarks show that the mac Studio is almost twice as powerful as the iMac i9. When I render with corona, that difference is not seen, but when I render with the native cinema engine, yes. I have selected a movie scene and I have rendered it with the iMac and with the mac Studio. The iMac returns a time of 8min-48sec and the mac Studio a time of 4min-56sec. I have a lot of trust in the Corona team and you are the ones who have more information than us. We do not question your work, quite the contrary, we appreciate all the news and corona operation. I just want to add that after several tests I have the feeling that the optimization so that Corona is native in Apple Silicon processors is not being able to take advantage of all the performance of these processors. I can guarantee you that these processors are wonderful because I have 3 different computers with apple silicon and both in 3d and in graphic design I have noticed a great performance improvement in the software I use. I just want to ask you to give this topic one more review and tell us how we can help. Possibly we have to talk to Apple to help us all, because there is some concept of this transition that we are forgetting. I am going to continue using corona because I feel very comfortable with the render engine and cinema 4d, I also feel more comfortable on my mac computers than on windows. My plans are to acquire the third corona license because I want to expand the workforce, but what would make me happier is that this issue be studied again in case there is the possibility of improving the performance of corona render when rendering and taking advantage of all the power of apple silicon. Thank you very much for everything and best regards.

2023-03-31, 11:55:35
Reply #21

Philw

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At the end of the day a 10core iMac (20 threads) i9 has much higher speed base clocks than the 20 core Ultra - so there I would expect the i9 to win in certain tasks - and also the Intel Embree rendering libraries that had to be converted to work on Apple Silicon are no doubt still in their early stages of optimisation - so I think there are still things going on/ being developed.

2023-03-31, 12:22:21
Reply #22

Chules

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I would like to add that I am trying to pass this matter on to the apple developers to see if they can provide some help on this issue.

2023-03-31, 12:34:54
Reply #23

Chules

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At the end of the day a 10core iMac (20 threads) i9 has much higher speed base clocks than the 20 core Ultra - so there I would expect the i9 to win in certain tasks - and also the Intel Embree rendering libraries that had to be converted to work on Apple Silicon are no doubt still in their early stages of optimisation - so I think there are still things going on/ being developed.
Thanks for your comment. The way you explain it, I understand it very well and what you say makes a lot of sense. But... why when I run the cinebench test on multicore is the mac Studio almost twice as fast as the iMac i9? Shouldn't it be logical that something similar would happen with a crown? Is it possible that when those libraries are ported to apple silicon, Corona will return results that are more similar to those of the native cinema 4d engine? I'm just trying to help and see what limits can be reached with these processors and this rendering engine.

2023-03-31, 12:48:29
Reply #24

Philw

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I agree on the Cinebench - that doesn't make a lot of sense!

2023-03-31, 13:00:53
Reply #25

Chules

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I agree on the Cinebench - that doesn't make a lot of sense!
According to Embree on its website, it says that both cinema 4d and corona use the Intel® Embree library. It seems that previous versions were already prepared for apple silicon. There is a new version, but I don't understand if it has optimizations for apple. Do you think that this is where the optimization can be to improve something? If so, I can't know, I still don't understand the results I get with the native render of cinema 4d. This is the point that makes me doubt that we can have better rendering times on apple silicon. Thank you so much.

2023-03-31, 13:22:10
Reply #26

TomG

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Could it be the overheating issue as reported in https://forum.corona-renderer.com/index.php?topic=38220.0 ?

It's a long thread, but basically some Apple machines are not able to keep themselves cool under continuous full load. Yes, Corona can put things under "more load" than other software even if the crude high level monitoring says "100% usage" for Corona and the other software, not every 100% is created equal. After some minutes of rendering they can throttle themselves due to the heat. This can be avoided using low power mode, depending on how long the render is and how long before the machine throttles; that is, does "full speed for X minutes + throttled for Y minutes" give better times than "lower power mode for Z minutes" - the longer the "Y minutes" the more likely the low power mode option is best.
Tom Grimes | chaos-corona.com
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2023-03-31, 13:56:57
Reply #27

Philw

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The main overheating "issue" shouldn't be a thing on the Studio as much as on the laptops - but who knows what "cleverness" Apple have put in there.

2023-04-02, 08:59:38
Reply #28

Oxocan London

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Short message regarding slow speeds on the New M-Macs.

I think that many people are forgetting that Corona Renderer is a CPU-based renderer not a GPU renderer. It's all about the machine's CPU performance and the number of cores. I am still using the Mac Pro Desktop 2013 (trashcan). It has 12 cores CPU and I honestly do not see the benefit of buying a new M1 or even M2 if Corona renderer is my end-game.

My wife uses a fully spect M1 MacBook Pro, 16". I did a hands-on test using everyday workflows and I am extremely glad I did not buy the M1. It has exactly the same speed as my trashcan, if not slower due to its 10 cores CPU vs my 12 Cores CPU. As mentioned earlier this is purely a CPU test.

On the other hand, if you are rendering in Redshift or even Arnold, my trashcan is dead in the water. I could not believe the speed in which the M1, 16" mac performs the same scene, literally 3-4 times faster! This is a massive improvement. Having said that, I am going to wait it out to see what Apple has in mind with the 3nm chips expected in Oct.

Hope this helps!

Have a lovely Sunday everyone!

Ian
Oxocan Team
Ian
Oxocan London

2023-04-03, 10:17:26
Reply #29

Philw

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@Chules - just wondering - you haven't accidentally limited the number of cores on the i9 Cinebench in the preferences have you? (Something I've done before!)

2023-04-04, 17:24:08
Reply #30

Chules

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@Chules - just wondering - you haven't accidentally limited the number of cores on the i9 Cinebench in the preferences have you? (Something I've done before!)
To the best of my knowledge, I believe that I am performing the test correctly and there are other people with the same results. Attached screenshot of the test. When you perform the test, 20 buckets can be viewed. This same test in mac Studio yields a score of 24,000 points compared to 13,000 for the iMac i9 10C/20T.
Value you, I speak from limited knowledge in terms of hardware.
« Last Edit: 2023-04-04, 17:38:23 by Chules »

2023-04-04, 17:50:03
Reply #31

Philw

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Yes those numbers do look about right according to the internet! 20 core Ultra makes sense as my 10 core M1Max MBP scored just short of 12000 pts.

So I was expecting more of the i9 but maybe my logic is off - but in turn that does make the Corona results odd too.

2023-04-04, 17:57:51
Reply #32

Chules

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Yes those numbers do look about right according to the internet! 20 core Ultra makes sense as my 10 core M1Max MBP scored just short of 12000 pts.

So I was expecting more of the i9 but maybe my logic is off - but in turn that does make the Corona results odd too.
That is why I insist, there is something that does not fit me and I think that we can do something to improve or help.

2023-04-05, 18:56:18
Reply #33

Philw

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