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Messages - jojorender

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I think it depends on the initial price you charge, how many revisions this would allow.
I break down my pricing into 3 parts.
  • “Building 3D model” from construction plans - 1 clay render / revision. Any structural changes, +50% of base price.
  • “Staging / materials” - first preview,1revision, second preview included. Any additional revision +50% of “staging” base price.
  • “Rendering” price. - incl. rendering, retouching, print and web file output. Any additional image, if no addl. modeling or staging is required will cost the “rendering” price.
I let my clients know that I can offer “this great price” because I don’t factor in several revisions that are not needed if communication is clear from the start..
Also, if several revisions are “needed”, let your client know at each step how much the additional cost is. Money is the ONLY language clients understand.
Your situation is even better because you can address the “revisions til death” with them from the beginning.

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-28, 18:45:24 »
I picked the 8min mark on the M1max to find a noise or pass level that is challenging enough and doesn’t take too long to test.
Ultimately, this test is to find out how Apple Silicon compares to Intel/AMD in a “real world” scenario.
Since there’s such a big difference in render time with VFB on or off and also the macOs power settings, maybe it’s best to first figure out what’s going on there, before setting test parameters?

@Philw is there any difference when rendering to PV, opening VFB to establish the connection and closing VFB again? Or you only get the faster times after c4d restart and no connection between PV and VFB?

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-27, 21:45:04 »
I would say that's a LOT better!
Definitely strange that the VFB might throttle performance.
Maybe other M1 users can confirm this?   

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-27, 20:12:43 »
Interesting… So instead of Intel’s thermal throttling, there might be a apple imposed performance throttle.
While the M1max was about 14% faster in the grapes c4d physical scene, it was about 56% slower in Corona native M1.
Not sure what this all means, but might be helpful info for the corona team.

Out of curiosity, I TR’ed this scene with 2x 10c/20t + 1x 8c/16t (closest I can get to your 32c/64t) set to your rippers 403 passes.
Took 8:52. This result makes sense.

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-27, 17:03:35 »
Hi Philw,
Thanks for running this test.
I ran the test again set to your 4.2% noise level. Strangely it finished in 3:30
I assumed the M1max is faster than my 10850K.
Did you have any demanding things running in the background?
The only difference I can see from your screenshot, your build is Feb. 16 and I’m on Feb. 1
Any idea what’s going on?

Don't worry about Team Render. That brings with it too many other variables to be useful as a "how good is my CPU at rendering a real job?" question.
You’re definitely right about “too many variables”, but still can help deciding if replacing cheap render nodes with a ripper is worth it.

First off, let me say that I understand that Corona needs to raise prices since everything else around us is getting more expensive.
Don’t hate the player, hate the game!
I also understand that for current license holders “everything” will stay the same in regard to render nodes.
In this blog post from last year you talk about node usage data and how small players subsidizing big players that heavily use render nodes.
While I do have a 3 node license and won’t be effected (for now…), I think leaving a small tier 3 nodes or 2 or heck, even 1 node would be very helpful for the “small players”. 
According to the yearly 3 and 5 node price difference, you valued 1 render node at €30 that will jump 233% to €100.
3 render nodes will then cost more than a full license. 
When it comes to “subsidizing big players”, one could argue that c4d users have for years subsidized Corona Scatter and the Corona DR solution for max users, while we used the c4d build-in tools like the fragile team render framework and mograph, etc.

I honestly believe that this move will hurt the “small players” the most, that already struggle with pricing their renderings in this economy.
I also have the feeling that it’s probably just a matter of time that “grandfathered” licenses will loose their nodes too.

So how about, every license comes with 3 nodes included and after that €100 per node? Win/Win for all?!
Thank you, Chaos-rona!!! 

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-26, 19:06:58 »
This scene was also my first contact with Corona and blew my mind back then…
“The only concern, is it challenging enough for a real test?”
I know exactly what you mean and of course you don't care about 1.5 sec, but if 50% faster means 2 hrs instead of 4 I'm sure you do care.
I ran the scene again with a 2% noise level and it rendered in 16:22. That might be a bit long for the casual tester.
If Philw is up for it and wants to test this on his M1 and Threadripper and establish a noise level  on the M1 around the 8 min mark… Maybe that’s a good compromise?
Unfortunately this scene doesn’t render in TR as is, need to remove
“WhiteGlass” > vray comp tag.
Would love to see how fast M1 + ripper renders this scene to 2% noise

I mostly render 6-8K stills to 3% noise and 4-6hrs is "normal" for me. If I can get this down 50% for a reasonable price, I'd be more than happy.

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-25, 20:31:09 »
@Philw's render time of 3:07 is good, but barely faster than my 2017 iMac Pro. Granted, this thing cost a lot back then. Maybe $,8000. Can't remember.
Let’s not forget we are talking about a laptop here. I still think it’s pretty impressive.
I’m also waiting for that Mac Pro (mini) with several SOC’s glued together, and knowing how well this scales from a M1max or how it compares to a threadripper in corona is useful info.
All my intel macs are currently heating my workspace, which I can also clearly see on my electric bill. So, yes please give me something less power hungry.
Just for reference, that i9-10850k/64GB was a $1k build (no gpu - only render node)

There is this very old free scene on the blog that might be useful.
It popped up a missing plugin warning but strangely didn’t ask to convert any corona assets to new core.
- delete vray bridge and GI from render settings
- changed the pass limit 9999 to 5% noise
- turn off bloom and glare in corona/ camera tab!!!
Could this be good scene for testing?

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-25, 13:57:16 »
Thanks Philw
I assume this is M1 native?
Shows us how far off the corona benchmark is regarding M1 (rosetta)
Ran the bench with same I9-10850K

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-25, 02:20:40 »
I ran the scene on a 2 year old 10c/20t hack - I9 10850K with a gentle 4.7G overclock.
3:35 min - not on fire but might be the closest to a M1max?

I still think a Corona scene could be more useful.
For example, does M1 native in Corona scale the same as “M1 native” in physical renderer?
Do updates to the corona core, shaders (C-bitmap), etc make the engine faster?
How well does TR scale in different configs.
This would be more than just a pure “machine power” comparison, but would mean people need to be clear about how they tested, including screenshots of VFB, cor version, Mac specs, etc.
This could potentially get messy and maybe not as helpful as I think...
Tried to 1-click convert the scene to corona - no go, unless you like black grapes.

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-23, 14:57:08 »
Not sure what scene you are referring to. Can you link to the scene?
Benchmark update - I think the argument is that all test results will not be comparable if old and new results are mixed.

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: Corona for Apple Silicon M1?
« on: 2022-02-23, 14:19:23 »
Have I understand it correctly that M1 Max running Corona Renderer native renders at about twice the time as the old iMac i9? Wow that came as a huge surprise. Wouldnt M1 Max run faster then an Imac i9?
These numbers are according to the Corona benchmark results? The Corona benchmark is a old standalone app that doesn’t run M1 native. If the claim of 45-50 % faster rendering in native mode is true… well…
I think it would be good to have a “c4d test scene” that can be shared here that renders in about 10 min or so on a modern system. That would give us a more real representation of how M1’s compare to Intel macs. That would also show how much advantage team rendering can bring.
All scenes I have, use assets that I’m not allowed to share. Anybody here has a somewhat demanding scene that they can share?

[C4D] General Discussion / Re: IES lights
« on: 2022-02-11, 00:33:46 »
Ah yes, the exclusive checkboxes.

I'll log it internally.

This is still happening in V8 Daily Build 2022-02-02. Is nobody checking the installer before posting?

Sorry for the stupid question! Of course not, that's what users are for ;-)

You are looking in the wrong library... See screenshot.

[C4D] I need help! / Re: .mtl issue again
« on: 2022-02-06, 16:38:18 »
I’m sure the mtl gets correctly imported but has no texture link or color information.
You can check this by opening the mtl file in a text editor. Rename to .txt
I wouldn’t waist my time with this. Never came across a useful mtl file.
The best you can hope for is that materials have all different colors to quickly identify which mesh they belong to.    

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