Author Topic: [ARCHIVE] Pre-1.0 Daily builds  (Read 156932 times)

2014-09-11, 12:28:52
Reply #60

maru

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Yup, it is impressive! I'd love to see some good renders (like Juraj's works) enhanced with this, even just for comparison.
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2014-09-11, 14:12:22
Reply #61

Juraj

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Yup, it is impressive! I'd love to see some good renders (like Juraj's works) enhanced with this, even just for comparison.

I desperately can't wait to try, just need to finish few pictures in A7 for Friday so I am avoiding possible trouble :- ) I thought someone would post their sooner.
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2014-09-11, 14:33:47
Reply #62

daniel.reutersward

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Can´t wait until the GGX shader finds its way to a public build (no daily builds access)! :) And I´m also a bit surprised no one has displayed any renders with GGX.

2014-09-11, 15:26:27
Reply #63

lacilaci

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Can´t wait until the GGX shader finds its way to a public build (no daily builds access)! :) And I´m also a bit surprised no one has displayed any renders with GGX.

Yeah, I'm bit surprised too, I guess everyone is just too busy atm. Also it is not enough just switch from standard to ggx to get proper results.. Some of my materials, mainly rough reflections looked way more rough with just switching to ggx so more tweaking is needed..

2014-09-11, 15:46:53
Reply #64

daniel.reutersward

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Can´t wait until the GGX shader finds its way to a public build (no daily builds access)! :) And I´m also a bit surprised no one has displayed any renders with GGX.

Yeah, I'm bit surprised too, I guess everyone is just too busy atm. Also it is not enough just switch from standard to ggx to get proper results.. Some of my materials, mainly rough reflections looked way more rough with just switching to ggx so more tweaking is needed..

Yes, I guess so too. Good to know, however I´m really looking forward to be able to try it and looking forward to see some renders with it, been waiting for it for a while! :)

2014-09-11, 16:29:58
Reply #65

Ondra

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Fast comparison

GGX have longer "tail" of the reflection, meaning while highlight are still equally sharp, there is much larger halo around them. Overall, the GGX BRDF has nicer properties and looks like is slightly faster.
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2014-09-13, 21:42:07
Reply #66

pokoy

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Really great additions in the latest db's, GGX and mappable corner radius is fantastic and 'finished blend support' does sound good, too. I am travelling right now so had no chance to test but look forward to it.

One thing I have encountered when I tested the former (not the latest) db against 7.1 was that 7.1 was way faster, maybe even twice as fast. It may have to do with the fact that in the scenes I have rendered I use almost only Blend materials (all with mapped Diffuse, Reflection amt, Glossiness, Bump etc.), and lots of them. Is this known behavior or should I have a closer look and try to track down what causes it?

2014-09-13, 21:48:28
Reply #67

Juraj

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Had not yet time to install, will do so tomorrow, but found this:

http://adaptivesamples.com/2014/06/23/ashikhmin-shirley-distribution/

Compares GGX, Ashikmin and Beckman model. I had no idea what Corona had, I honestly thought it was blinn with some addition to enable anisotrophy, but as we've seen in ggx thread in general section, Corona already behaves with glossy shaders much nicer than Vray does with default blinn (but then again, Ward is almost nice, except for loss of energy, it's always considerably darker around edges).
So I guess that's why the difference isn't so prominent, but according to those comparison charts, it is, but it's vastly more noticeable in very rough materials, when GGX correctly shades rough metal to look almost as lambertian (correct behaviour), whereas, Shirley, looks more like odd sheen. Same with glossy shaders, the rough one looks more natural.

Can't wait to try it !
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2014-09-13, 21:58:33
Reply #68

Ondra

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Corona used slightly hacked Ashikhmin-Shirley model. Currently it is switched to GGX, and if nobody discovers any fatal flaw, will stay that way
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2014-09-13, 22:44:58
Reply #69

Ludvik Koutny

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Really great additions in the latest db's, GGX and mappable corner radius is fantastic and 'finished blend support' does sound good, too. I am travelling right now so had no chance to test but look forward to it.

One thing I have encountered when I tested the former (not the latest) db against 7.1 was that 7.1 was way faster, maybe even twice as fast. It may have to do with the fact that in the scenes I have rendered I use almost only Blend materials (all with mapped Diffuse, Reflection amt, Glossiness, Bump etc.), and lots of them. Is this known behavior or should I have a closer look and try to track down what causes it?

Try very recent daily build, and if the problem persists, then mail Keymaster with the scene. New DB should be slightly faster, or at least as fast as 7.1. If it's any slower, then theres hidden bug somewhere ;)

2014-09-14, 15:41:40
Reply #70

pokoy

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Thanks, will test the new DB and see if it got better.

2014-09-15, 00:39:44
Reply #71

Bigguns

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What about ABC model Keymaster?  The big advantage is that you can adjust the tail, wich we cannot with GGX.. so we will have to blend some GGX reflection layer to get multi pole reflection we want.. would be very cool to get ABC too, it's better to me since you can adjust it and no need to have many layers to get the effect wanted. What do you think?

2014-09-15, 09:10:50
Reply #72

Ludvik Koutny

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I think the idea with GGX was to implement more modern BRDF. Not to go back to blinn and phong times where people had to adjust 3 different parameters to fake out what they wanted. There will be real layering system (something like MILA/Cycles/Octane) implemented at some point, so creating proper layers should not be much of a problem.

2014-09-15, 16:54:01
Reply #73

Bigguns

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Sounds good for the layering system can't wait!  But so far as I know ABC shader is more recent then GGx no? here it says : "ABC" is a brdf model proposed in 2012 by Joakim Löw, Joel Kronander, Anders Ynnerman, Jonas Unger

Here a link to a guy  that made a plugin for vray, look at the tail, very cool! you can really adjust it for you own need :)  http://www.shlyaev.com/rnd/37-cpp-category/55-abcvray    so you can create like many reflection lobe with only one layer of reflection, it's more accurate that multilayer and it should render faster then multilayers reflection.

As he says :  ABC has sort of separate controls over specular peak and tail. It is possible to have sharp peak and long tail with this model like those in chrome metal.

Let me know what you think, GGX is good, but this one feel more.. next gen if you want, ABC can do what GGX do bbut GGX can't do what ABC do and I really think Corona should be at the forehead of everything and get the best. No one would complain of one more shader model in Corona :) 

And since the mentality of Corona is to  have a simple and straight forward workflow, I think it suit it perfectly to get that nextgen shader (before everyone else.. oups I think renderman already included though ^^ ) because with that shader we don't really need ( maybe rarely in some special case) us to have multi layers to get what we want.  To me, ABC BRDF is the best so far.
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« Last Edit: 2014-09-15, 17:06:32 by Bigguns »

2014-09-15, 17:34:46
Reply #74

Bigguns

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hmm and more recently, there is a new (august 2014..) shader model that emerged ... is it even  better then ABC shader? http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~gfx/pmwiki/index.php?n=Pubs.Brady2014DNA

Too technical for me, I let Keymaster figure it out :)

Shaders model are very very important for a renderer ,lot's of renderer out there underestimate that fact.