3ds max + Corona + Windows = Finally good performance

[erisbejbe]

Hello everybody!

I've opened this thread only to share this few basic tips which are a result of two years of problems and recently improved my performance drastically.


[short introduction]

I've just opened an account on this forum just to tell you this important information regarding performance. I've been using Corona as my main work tool since version 1.2. I work as an interior designer and Corona has become my main tool even though I am very skilled in Vray. Over the years I've been having CONSTANT problems with various versions of 3ds max and Corona and of course - windows. Many don't understand how many bugs are produced by bad 3ds max architecture (nothing to do with Corona), and even worse bugs are produced by windows. Like many, i just need things to WORK because my business depends on it. Every one of this tips has been tested and verified over and over and trust me, I have had crazy 12-hour full exterior overnight projects and I really know what I'm talking about.


[technical tips]

-I will start by saying: if you use Corona and 3ds max you absolutely HAVE TO use Windows PRO , not home and lower variants.

-(most important tip)- DISABLE windows defender, DISABLE firewall. Now, I've done this years ago in windows defender and in control panel and it didn't work. It's very important to do this by group policies editor in Windows pro and up and/or via registry editor. Only that way will completely disable it.
Explanation: it solves the most annoying performance hitter which is (LONG) waiting every time you start up 3ds max, close 3ds max, start rendering, stop interactive or regular rendering, loading maps, merging files, etc etc... This will save you so much time its crazy. Windows architecture is set up in a way that somehow has to scan and check all the files that come in through RAM and that is the main reason for slow performance.

-in my experience, 3ds max 2017 and 2018 were the last versions in which i am able to reach peak performance. Later 2019 and 2020 have issues admitted by Autodesk and not yet fixed. The improvements do not outweigh the problems.

-you don't need to use 3ds max as administrator, it gives you problems when merging files.,


These tips finally gave me the perfect experience. No crashes, no waiting, just work. Hope it helps.



Specs:

Threadripper 3970x
256GB ddr4 ram
2x1TB nvme samsung 970 pro raid

[Juraj]

Could you elaborate on your Group Policy settings?

Here is what I do currently:

1) Exploit protection exceptions for 3dsMax & Corona (almost everything OFF, not just Flow Guard)
2) Real-time protection exclusion for 3dsMax & Corona folders (in Program Files, as well as Users&AppData)

I considered this to be a good solution to exclude 3dsMax, but not disable (otherwise excellent) protections. Would love to see some benchmark what further improvements could be done by more drastic measures.

BTW: What's your memory kit ? And what speed is it running stable at 256GB ?

[Juraj]

Later 2019 and 2020 have issues admitted by Autodesk and not yet fixed. The improvements do not outweigh the problems.

If you have time, write a bit more about this too. There are never enough opinions on how bad 2020 is actually :- ). I am not sarcastic, I am honestly trying to make a more solid picture from all the reports as user of 2016.

[agentdark45]

I second Juraj's comments. Would like to see some real-world examples of this i.e time to max startup with bitdefender disabled, then firewall disabled vs stock.

I had a quick go at disabling some group policy settings for bitdefender as I'm running avast and no noticable differences were seen...

[Juraj]

I'm running avast

Please uninstall this shit right now :- ) I am fully serious.

It has no benefit compared to what is in Windows 10, and it's just actively spying on you and selling your data. It's the biggest crap-ware on market.
For those who absolutely need for some obscure reason something 3rd party, NOD by ESET is the only reputable solution.

But actually Windows 10 is more than enough.

https://www.techradar.com/news/avast-shuts-down-jumpshot-after-data-selling-controversy

- Avast sold user data
- Allowed breaching of VPN
- Is currently banned by all major goverments and businesses
- It was always shit to begin with (just like Kaspersky "I am not russian spyware" Suite)

[agentdark45]

I'm running avast

Please uninstall this shit right now :- ) I am fully serious.

It has no benefit compared to what is in Windows 10, and it's just actively spying on you and selling your data. It's the biggest crap-ware on market.
For those who absolutely need for some obscure reason something 3rd party, NOD by ESET is the only reputable solution.

But actually Windows 10 is more than enough.

https://www.techradar.com/news/avast-shuts-down-jumpshot-after-data-selling-controversy

- Avast sold user data
- Allowed breaching of VPN
- Is currently banned by all major goverments and businesses
- It was always shit to begin with (just like Kaspersky "I am not russian spyware" Suite)

Well, damn. Better get on it! Had no idea they messed up that bad. Thanks for the heads up man.

[shortcirkuit]

hey Juraj bit of a newb question but how do you actually do 1 and 2 that you mention below?

Could you elaborate on your Group Policy settings?

Here is what I do currently:

1) Exploit protection exceptions for 3dsMax & Corona (almost everything OFF, not just Flow Guard)
2) Real-time protection exclusion for 3dsMax & Corona folders (in Program Files, as well as Users&AppData)

I considered this to be a good solution to exclude 3dsMax, but not disable (otherwise excellent) protections. Would love to see some benchmark what further improvements could be done by more drastic measures.

BTW: What's your memory kit ? And what speed is it running stable at 256GB ?

[Vlad_the_rant]

To set exceptions for Max and Corona executables (most likely just needed for Max):

1) Open Windows Security
2) select App & Browser control
3) switch to "Program Settings"
4) Click on the "Add program to customize" button, select "Add by program name" and type in "3dsmax.exe" then click "Add"
5) find and select "3dsmax.exe" in the list
6) click "Edit"
7) mark every "Override system setttings" box in the list and make sure everything is set to "Off".
8) click apply
9) Done.

You can try the same thing for Corona executables but I doubt that will actually make a lot of difference as Corona is mainly a Max plugin so should inherit these settings from Max.

To add exceptions in real-time protection:

1) Open Windows security
2) Select "Virus & threat protection"
3) Click on "Manage settings" under "Virus & threat protection settings"
4) Scroll down to "Exclusions"
5) Click on "Add or remove exclusions
6) Click on "Add an exclusion" at the top.
7) Select "Folder"
8) Browse to your 3ds max folder, enter it, and click "Select folder". Confirm the UAC prompt.
9) Repeat number 8 for the Autodesk and Corona folders in Program Files and "c:\users\[username]\appdata\Local" and "C:\users\[username]\appdata\Roaming" folders.
10) Done.


WARNING!: This is inherently (albeit slightly) reducing your overall security and malicious software, if placed in and run from any of those folders, could still execute successfully and without your knowledge, bypassing security! Make these modifications at your own risk!
Chaos Czech a.s. will NOT be held accountable for any damage(s), loss of data and any other mishaps this may cause you!

[shortcirkuit]

Thanks so much for the detailed info - all was done however i couldnt find CORONA in the folder c:\users\[username]\appdata\Local" and "C:\users\[username]\appdata\Roaming"

Apart from that, all else was done and so far, to be honest, no noticeable differences at all.

My material editor is my main issue, always sluggish - on both of my workstations.  Its weird because somethings its snappy - most of the time it isnt.

To set exceptions for Max and Corona executables (most likely just needed for Max):

1) Open Windows Security
2) select App & Browser control
3) switch to "Program Settings"
4) Click on the "Add program to customize" button, select "Add by program name" and type in "3dsmax.exe" then click "Add"
5) find and select "3dsmax.exe" in the list
6) click "Edit"
7) mark every "Override system setttings" box in the list and make sure everything is set to "Off".
8) click apply
9) Done.

You can try the same thing for Corona executables but I doubt that will actually make a lot of difference as Corona is mainly a Max plugin so should inherit these settings from Max.

To add exceptions in real-time protection:

1) Open Windows security
2) Select "Virus & threat protection"
3) Click on "Manage settings" under "Virus & threat protection settings"
4) Scroll down to "Exclusions"
5) Click on "Add or remove exclusions
6) Click on "Add an exclusion" at the top.
7) Select "Folder"
8) Browse to your 3ds max folder, enter it, and click "Select folder". Confirm the UAC prompt.
9) Repeat number 8 for the Autodesk and Corona folders in Program Files and "c:\users\[username]\appdata\Local" and "C:\users\[username]\appdata\Roaming" folders.
10) Done.


WARNING!: This is inherently (albeit slightly) reducing your overall security and malicious software, if placed in and run from any of those folders, could still execute successfully and without your knowledge, bypassing security! Make these modifications at your own risk!
Chaos Czech a.s. will NOT be held accountable for any damage(s), loss of data and any other mishaps this may cause you!

[Vlad_the_rant]

The material editor being sluggish is the bane of Max. Using only one single thread for the entire interface also doesn't help it much.
I often face the same issue (with the slate material editor) and have found that more often than not, switching it to "Compatibility display mode" helps:
1) Open the slate material editor
2) Select "Options" in the menu and go to "Preferences"
3) Make sure the checkbox for "Use compatibility mode" at the bottom is set.
Unfortunately, this setting doesn't persist between Max sessions so you'll have to enable it every time (I do it if the material editor becomes sluggish).I haven't noticed any visible change in the way things are displayed with it on so I don't really know what it does, only that it can help and does help, sometimes.
For general Max responsiveness, you may also want to try some environment variables as we have described here (this also has some more tips that may be useful):https://coronarenderer.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/12000011479-my-3ds-max-is-very-slow-it-is-hard-to-navigate-in-the-viewport-or-use-the-material-editor-
The environment variables can sometimes help (helped me) but not always. Won't hurt to try them, though :)

[shortcirkuit]

Thanks so much for the info!!!

I will give that a god eventhough i dont use slate material editor - if it helps then i for sure will change my workflow!  The compact material edits is very slow.

Thx again mate.

The material editor being sluggish is the bane of Max. Using only one single thread for the entire interface also doesn't help it much.
I often face the same issue (with the slate material editor) and have found that more often than not, switching it to "Compatibility display mode" helps:
1) Open the slate material editor
2) Select "Options" in the menu and go to "Preferences"
3) Make sure the checkbox for "Use compatibility mode" at the bottom is set.
Unfortunately, this setting doesn't persist between Max sessions so you'll have to enable it every time (I do it if the material editor becomes sluggish).I haven't noticed any visible change in the way things are displayed with it on so I don't really know what it does, only that it can help and does help, sometimes.
For general Max responsiveness, you may also want to try some environment variables as we have described here (this also has some more tips that may be useful):https://coronarenderer.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/12000011479-my-3ds-max-is-very-slow-it-is-hard-to-navigate-in-the-viewport-or-use-the-material-editor-
The environment variables can sometimes help (helped me) but not always. Won't hurt to try them, though :)

[Vlad_the_rant]

The compact editor is slow for simply exactly the same reasons the whole interface is slow - single threadedness and Max's tendency to slow down over time, even if you're not doing anything with it. This problem has been there since forever, unfortunately, and it increasingly looks like it will not be resolved unless the whole thing is rewritten from the ground up (which will probably never happen as Autodesk needs to keep the releases on a yearly schedule to appease investors and one year is by far not enough to fully rewrite such a complex thing as Max from the ground up).
What might help are the environment variables for the interface drawing and restarting the computer often (because restarting the whole machine is the only true and proven way of making Max run fast again, at least for some while).

[agentdark45]

The compact editor is slow for simply exactly the same reasons the whole interface is slow - single threadedness and Max's tendency to slow down over time, even if you're not doing anything with it. This problem has been there since forever, unfortunately, and it increasingly looks like it will not be resolved unless the whole thing is rewritten from the ground up (which will probably never happen as Autodesk needs to keep the releases on a yearly schedule to appease investors and one year is by far not enough to fully rewrite such a complex thing as Max from the ground up).
What might help are the environment variables for the interface drawing and restarting the computer often (because restarting the whole machine is the only true and proven way of making Max run fast again, at least for some while).

I'm fairly certain Tyson Ibele (the guy behind Tyflow) could sort out max given enough time. He's recently multi threaded the smooth operator and completely re-written the animation preview feature in a couple of days. Why Autodesk doesn't hire him is beyond me!

[iancamarillo]

If I'm not mistaken, Max would need to be completely rewritten down to the core in order to utilize today's multi core tech? Everything from viewport performance to UI redraw. Also the  interoperability with other Autodesk products, for example the math behind drawing an ellipse in Autocad is different than Max.

[Vlad_the_rant]

Current versions of Max contain code from Max 1.0 on top of which, due to frequent changing of hands/teams working on it, new stuff was just piled on and piled on. In the end, today, we have a hack on a hack working through a hack in order to hack in functionality of another hack that was needed to hack the code from version 1.0 to work with code inherited from 3d studio for DOS so that the hack that actually works can be hacked in and work. That's kinda putting it in very simplified terms.
Nothing but a total rewrite or a miracle can fix this.

[maru]

Nothing but a total rewrite or a miracle can fix this.

I don't think a miracle without a rewrite would help.

[Vlad_the_rant]

You never know :)
Autodesk hasn't been known much for miracles but they DO happen :)

[Giona]

Hi guys, do you know any other tips to improve 3dsmax stability and speed with Win10 Pro?

I remember reading something that Windows 10 does when an application crash frequently, and it try to solve the problem running the app in a sort of compatibility mode the next time you open it.

I recently built a new workstation and I want to optimize it as much as possible :)

[maru]

I remember reading something that Windows 10 does when an application crash frequently, and it try to solve the problem running the app in a sort of compatibility mode the next time you open it.

That's FTH - thankfully Corona catches it when FTH includes 3ds Max or related processes and warns about it. My suggestion is to always disable it fully. :)
See: https://coronarenderer.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/5000678431

[Juraj]

I think it's time for definite "Setting up Windows 10 for (rendering) work" write-up :- ).

It's getting hard to even remember it all, setting it all from ground up after every re-install is pain.
I was huge fan of Windows 10 originally, but it's becoming far too candy-crush optimized.

[Giona]

That's FTH - thankfully Corona catches it when FTH includes 3ds Max or related processes and warns about it. My suggestion is to always disable it fully. :)
See: https://coronarenderer.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/5000678431

Thanks Marcin!

I think it's time for definite "Setting up Windows 10 for (rendering) work" write-up :- ).

It's getting hard to even remember it all, setting it all from ground up after every re-install is pain.
I was huge fan of Windows 10 originally, but it's becoming far too candy-crush optimized.

I totally agree!
Are you going to write it? :)

[maru]

Remember the old Windows XP "patchers" that would remove the arrow icon from shortcuts, etc? Maybe we should just ship something similar with Corona installer. :)

[Charlie Nicols]

It would be really helpful to have some kind of automated setup to make your max/corona/windows environment work better.

[arqrenderz]

The windows defender trick is doing something here, I would have to measure thing up but the placebo effect must be high, material editor, rendering starts are working faster.

[iancamarillo]

I tried setting the windows defender antivirus to disabled in the local group policy editor but didn't notice anything. Do I need to also turn off the windows firewall?
On a side note, after I disabled defender qtwebengineprocess.exe started running in the background and maxed out 128gb of ram. I deleted the 3ds max install folder, which contains qtwebengineprocess.exe, sitting on my desktop and that problem went away. But I think it's unrelated to disabling the defender antivirus.

[1equals2]

I would like to add few additional insights, although not specifically related to the "Defender" thing.
Still using one machine here, but noticed considerable decrease in performance and stability after several Windows 10 updates, which occurred around end of March.
It was mostly related to 3ds max instability, frequent freezes which eventually influenced Corona experience.
Made investigation as read a post somewhere that the following windows 10 updates "B4535996, KB4540673 and KB4551762" can cause some serious trouble.
Happened to have had  installed the latter and after removing it - back to normal.

Completely support the idea that we need to organize a windows 10/3ds max file or note where to put most common software related stuff that might be the real culprit behind some of the issues people are experiencing.
I am personally working from a network and almost every single file becomes  quite slow at certain point. Trying to avoid keeping multiple 3ds max instances opened as well, but... avoiding is not a solution. :)
Still using 3ds max 2018.3 but it is bit sluggish in UI, bit slow and more unstable than 3ds max 2018. Tempted to try most recent versions, but really do not want to go down the rabbit hole.